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Harbeth speakers - discussion thread

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Post by wywong on Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:22 pm

Dear Sifus,



I am looking forward to to a pair of used HL5. Any advice that i can get in terms of the sound in comparison to the new Compact 7? All advice is welcome.

Thanks.

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Post by uncle_vic on Sat Aug 20, 2011 9:38 am

Any luck so far looking for a pair? Between the 2 mentioned, both equally good sounding, it's a matter of preference. The problem starts when u want to have both! Laughing .

Best bet, listen for yourself at Sam's place, Tropical Audio. Sam maybe able to find a pair for u, if only u ask him! If u do drop by Sam's place, give me a howler, can yumcha, I stay nearby his place.

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Post by fizi on Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:04 am

wywong wrote:Dear Sifus,



I am looking forward to to a pair of used HL5. Any advice that i can get in terms of the sound in comparison to the new Compact 7? All advice is welcome.

Thanks.

Dear wywong - if u able to listen the comparison between HL Compact 7es3 and HL5 let share the outcome here...im also wondering is there any big improvement compare to the old version of Compact 7 for instance HL Compact model Question

Thanks
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Post by wywong on Sat Aug 27, 2011 10:46 am

Hi Uncle Vic, plan to drop by at Sam's place coming monday around 4pm, want to meet up there?



Hi Fizi, hopefully i get to try out both the 7 and 5 this coming Monday, sure will give my opinion in due course....cheers

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Post by oracle on Sat Aug 27, 2011 10:52 am

Hi wong, if you interested on Harbeth 7ES-3 cherry color, i d very mint condition almost new> Customer bought but having financial issue - need to sell. Interested call me /sms 012-4255023 Pg
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Post by hi5papa on Thu Nov 03, 2011 10:35 am

how much does a new harbeth 7ES-3 cost?

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Post by Mikapoh on Thu Nov 03, 2011 10:44 am

hi5papa wrote:how much does a new harbeth 7ES-3 cost?

It should be in the region of RM8k ~ RM8.5k. Call Tropical Audio for the price & demo Very Happy


No harm to make appointment with them too.

Cheers.

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Post by fizi on Fri Nov 04, 2011 7:32 pm

oracle wrote:Hi wong, if you interested on Harbeth 7ES-3 cherry color, i d very mint condition almost new> Customer bought but having financial issue - need to sell. Interested call me /sms 012-4255023 Pg

Hifipapa...if i not mistaken Rm7k plus...try call
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Post by cmboy on Fri Nov 04, 2011 8:57 pm

If not mistaken where last seen at KLAV 2011, Harbeth prices have increased by some percentage. Of course best to check with Tropical Audio for accurate price.

What to do? Currency exchange go down, goods price increase. Our currency appreciate, also price increase. Either way you're screwed, because we can't produce such items here.
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Post by hi5papa on Sat Nov 05, 2011 4:59 am

fizi wrote:
oracle wrote:Hi wong, if you interested on Harbeth 7ES-3 cherry color, i d very mint condition almost new> Customer bought but having financial issue - need to sell. Interested call me /sms 012-4255023 Pg

Hifipapa...if i not mistaken Rm7k plus...try call

that day i enquire for a neat speakers ..cost about the same in RM7K region...i got feedback from the seller that speaker really kicking assh..anybody can share ? from the spec it looks small and slim..can it shake the floor ka? i am deeply in doubt..Question

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Post by mugenfoo on Sat Nov 05, 2011 8:13 am

if u want floor-shakers, neither Neat nor Harbeth are the right candidates for the job.

You'd be better off going for Cerwin-Vega! or some big cabinet JBL speakers.
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Post by fizi on Sat Nov 05, 2011 9:39 am

mugenfoo wrote:if u want floor-shakers, neither Neat nor Harbeth are the right candidates for the job.

You'd be better off going for Cerwin-Vega! or some big cabinet JBL speakers.

Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil
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Post by wywong on Sat Nov 05, 2011 10:02 am

[quote="fizi"]
mugenfoo wrote:if u want floor-shakers, neither Neat nor Harbeth are the right candidates for the job.

You'd be better off going for Cerwin-Vega! or some big cabinet JBL speakers.

lol! True, Harbeths wont shake your room, but they'll sing.

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Post by mugenfoo on Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:46 pm

Seems that Alan Shaw has had a change of heart recently regarding the use of proper amps to drive his speakers...

http://www.harbeth.co.uk/usergroup/showthread.php?1444-Getting-a-3D-holographic-presentation-from-40.1&p=16424#post16424
Alan Shaw at the H.U.G wrote:
150W available to drive M40.1 and a first class amplifier brand reputation says to me that this is home setup is likely to deliver a great sonic experience with oodles of power reserve for those thrilling climaxes.

Consider this imperfect analogy: the (incandescent) light bulb lighting your room may well have a 150W rating. That will fill every corner of your room with bright light. Remove that bulb and fit a 15W (one tenth of the power) and what then? The room is miserably dark: there are deep shadows in the corners. You cannot even read. You are stumbling around in the gloom. Why would you want to live like that when you are advised that 50W is necessary to throw the minimum light into the environment?

I don't just dream-up the minimum amplifier requirements for the fun of it. I am aware that if I suggest a minimum amplifier power rating that's too high, those customers with smaller amps may be frightened off Harbeth and select another brand which emphasises higher efficiency. Conversely, I am aware that to produce a reasonable sound pressure level that gives a satisfying quasi-real life experience a certain amount of power is necessary. So the minimum power amp ratings I've listed in the brochure are really minimums bearing in mind that you should interpret the manufacturer's amplifier power outputs with a very large degree of scepticism. Outside the lab, many amps are unlikely to be able to deliver their rated power on music when driving real-world speakers.

What tube fans don't realise (and I've heard SHL5s driven by 300B 7W tubes and sounding good) is that when you connect a 'scope across the 7W amp's output terminals and look at the music waveform, it shows significant clipping. And that clipping may be present for 25%, 50% or even 100% of the time. That shouldn't be a surprise at all: 7W is a minuscule amount of power. So how is it that those users are satisfied with what they hear? Simple - the tube amp (and I stress this, the situation with a transistor amp is totally different) clips is a sonically benign way. In other words, it runs out of power in a way which does not immediately reveal itself to the human ear. It doesn't sound hard or coarse when clipping: it sounds fat and warm. And that's all part of the magic sonic experience of small (tube) amps.

So - rule of thumb: give yourself a fighting chance of high fidelity sound at home: have a sensible amount of amplifier power available at all times.


Alan A. Shaw

Designer, owner
Harbeth Audio UK


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Post by JediSavant on Mon Nov 21, 2011 4:46 pm

Come, let's hook up my 5watt powerhouse to some Harbeths readily available for some fat warm clipping!!
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Post by khlim_77 on Sun Dec 11, 2011 7:48 pm

Hi harbeth fan i was back again , hv your match harbeth speaker with sugden compare to quad ? Itch now
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Post by fizi on Sun Dec 11, 2011 11:07 pm

khlim_77 wrote:Hi harbeth fan i was back again , hv your match harbeth speaker with sugden compare to quad ? Itch now

Recently there is a member wanna sell sugden pre/power combo...if im stay nearby KL i will try meet that guy and do some audition Idea but as hotelier im quite busy during school holiday period so hmmmmm...try google harbeth user group forum maybe there is some input on this..
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Post by samazzah on Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:12 am

Harbeth speakers do match well with higher powered solid state amps because it helps to overcome/control the slight looseness of the bass, that Harbeth do have in order to have the 'warm' sounding bass. Seriously doubt if Sugden pre/power is a correct match - Sugden is also warm sounding. From a long time Harbeth user - Monitor 30s
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Post by is_jalil on Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:25 am

Hi khlim,

i'm currently using sugden a21a to push my p3 es2 with xtender, pretty happy with it for time being. Never listen to my set up driven by quad, so i can't comment on that. However if you are into vocal i believe tube will be a better bet.

Previously was using HL compact, the a21a just don't have enough power to make the speaker sing.

Maybe you would like to share what harbeth speaker & which quad model that you have in mind

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Post by fizi on Mon Dec 12, 2011 12:25 pm

Hi guys ...if anybody wanna listen to harbeth and quad set up just go to Tropical Audio showroom <------ Typical harbeth and quad combo Twisted Evil
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Post by alfred on Mon Dec 12, 2011 3:19 pm

hi guys, have anyone heard of the ls 5/12a before from harbeth. would u mind sharing some of your experience.
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Post by kychoo99 on Tue Dec 13, 2011 7:08 pm

alfred wrote:hi guys, have anyone heard of the ls 5/12a before from harbeth. would u mind sharing some of your experience.

So, my dear Alfred, finally you join the Harbeth Club eh .... though the driver is from Dynaudio, it is still a Harbeth ... rabbit Very Happy
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Post by khlim_77 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:15 pm

Hi , pls advise for the option below to match my cdp & harbeth
Cdp is marant cd 63ki, harbeth hlp3 speaker
quad pre 34 + 405.2
quad pre 44 + 405
Passive pre + quad 606
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Post by JediSavant on Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:20 pm

So you're going down the vintage Quad amplification route?

I believe a compact integrated amplifier like the Exposure 2010s2 or 3010s2 would make decent work of the Harbeths. They're current model amps, powerful, sonically sweet and dynamic, plus easy on the pocket.
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Post by khlim_77 on Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:48 pm

Hi Jedi. Thank's for your advise.
I did some audition on 3010s and not really like it
So i think vintage stil my cup of tea
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Post by fizi on Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:55 pm

khlim_77 wrote:Hi , pls advise for the option below to match my cdp & harbeth
Cdp is marant cd 63ki, harbeth hlp3 speaker
quad pre 34 + 405.2
quad pre 44 + 405
Passive pre + quad 606


Hi khlim....any quad above will do the job well done (except the passive,i not say its not good but better be sure they can match well) my self use 66/606mk2 combo with C7 Idea
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Post by khlim_77 on Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:03 pm

Hi fizi ,
Notice that u own b4 quad 405 & 606 , Can you sharing abt this two amp
Study the review notice that many 405 hv to replace cap & some transistor
Will it worth compare to 606 ?
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Post by fizi on Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:49 pm

khlim_77 wrote:Hi fizi ,
Notice that u own b4 quad 405 & 606 , Can you sharing abt this two amp
Study the review notice that many 405 hv to replace cap & some transistor
Will it worth compare to 606 ?

Due im using C7 i choose 606mk2 for more power....if no humming,sound not balance or distortion not necessary to change any cap or transistor .... if u have extra budget and to get fresh or like new sound yes this is applicable to all vintage equipment because the component will dry and have time limit...but as long the amp is working good what for we need to change it...let it be original because to get replacement we need to use new brand cap or transistor..is no point to replace NOS parts because even the component is not in use it still melting.... Very Happy

1 of hifi shop in ipoh have this 405mk2 try nego for the price 0165316308 Uncle Chiau
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Post by fizi on Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:59 pm

kh lim....decide on the pre amp already....im using 66 because of the remote Very Happy....34 or 44 also good both got their own character Very Happy
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Post by JediSavant on Sat Dec 24, 2011 10:57 am

A recent review of the Harbeth P3... http://www.hifizine.com/2011/12/harbeth-p3esr/ Enjoy!! Happy Holidays!
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Post by fizi on Sat Dec 24, 2011 12:25 pm

JediSavant wrote:A recent review of the Harbeth P3... http://www.hifizine.com/2011/12/harbeth-p3esr/ Enjoy!! Happy Holidays!

nice to read at.....tq
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Post by JediSavant on Sat Dec 24, 2011 5:34 pm

I just heard this puppy leashed up to a 400watt monster amp... shivers down me spine...
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Post by mugenfoo on Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:25 pm

JediSavant wrote:I just heard this puppy leashed up to a 400watt monster amp... shivers down me spine...

Define "this puppy" ? The Harbeth P3ESR loudspeaker?

Which crazy psychotic nut-job would drive Harbeth P3ESR with a 400w monster amp !!!????
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Post by khlim_77 on Sun Dec 25, 2011 10:07 pm

Hi fizi
I going to collect my 44 & 405 soon , how can i check this vintage amp especially on the cap part ?
Merry christmas to all harbeth fan
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Post by JediSavant on Mon Dec 26, 2011 1:31 am

mugenfoo wrote:
JediSavant wrote:I just heard this puppy leashed up to a 400watt monster amp... shivers down me spine...

Define "this puppy" ? The Harbeth P3ESR loudspeaker?

Which crazy psychotic nut-job would drive Harbeth P3ESR with a 400w monster amp !!!????


Only a Jedi would have the courage to do so.

The vocals and mids were fantastic, right where the magic is. With a bit of work, I'm confident that imaging and focusing would have been even tighter. Part of the to-do-list for another day.

Paul Simon's Graceland worked well, but I'd love to hear some small ensemble jazz through such a set up. It's amusing, it's damn entertaining, and it was a privilege.
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Post by moderneagle on Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:21 am

Hi all, moderneagle checking in. Still running me compact 7 with 'em olde Quads Smile

Happy holidays all.

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Post by fizi on Mon Dec 26, 2011 9:35 pm

khlim_77 wrote:Hi fizi
I going to collect my 44 & 405 soon , how can i check this vintage amp especially on the cap part ?
Merry christmas to all harbeth fan

test it 1st....google internal picture then compare is there any major different on parts....after set up all equipments try cranking up the volume control without playing any source and here is there any noise or funny sound from the speaker....if any,u need service both of the unit and replace some small small resistor or caps already leaks Exclamation routine exercise for vintage amp Wink

good luck cheers
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Post by fizi on Mon Dec 26, 2011 9:50 pm

moderneagle wrote:Hi all, moderneagle checking in. Still running me compact 7 with 'em olde Quads Smile

Happy holidays all.

sure enjoying 66+606 combo Very Happy
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Post by mugenfoo on Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:39 pm

moderneagle wrote:Hi all, moderneagle checking in. Still running me compact 7 with 'em olde Quads Smile

Happy holidays all.

Whoaaaa.... where did u just fly in from? Thought the big bird went migratory already! Anyways, Happy holidays to you too !
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Post by Mahler 9 on Thu Jan 05, 2012 12:01 am

If really like Harbeth sound do stay away from the 5/12a due to the limitaion of the mid/bass driver on it. Any old P3 onwards is much better. The 5/12a was a failure.

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Post by alfred on Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:11 am

Mahler 9 when u said limitation on the mid/bass driver would u care to elaborate more n what system have u heard before driving this 5/12a?
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Post by Mahler 9 on Thu Jan 05, 2012 11:09 am

The famous Harbeth sound of today, beside BBC heritage and superior xo network, is mainly due to Alan's excellent Radial cone mid/bass driver. The 5/12a mid/bass driver eat detail and poor power efficiency. It's short life in the market and not available anymore. I heard it few time back in late 1990s and early 2000s can not rmbr other gears thought, It's carry Harbeth tag but without Harbeth sound. In fact, it is not really a product from BBC heritage even it had LS in the model name. The main failure in 5/12a was due to the mid/bass driver even with excellent xo design could not help much. If need small tiny Harbeth, any old P3 is far superior than it and best still the P3ESR with 5in Radial2 cone.

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Post by alfred on Thu Jan 05, 2012 11:43 am

u mean the p3 would have a bigger soundstage then the 5/12a, a richer mid voice then it, with deeper bass control then the 5/12a and the p3 would sound smoother then 5/12a?
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Post by Mahler 9 on Thu Jan 05, 2012 12:03 pm

What i can say is p3 sound better in term of tonality, musicality and right/correct than ls5/12a. But it is my own experience you may feel another way. what i trying to say is who need a true harbeth sound shd not consider the ls5/12a.

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Post by kychoo99 on Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:43 pm

Mahler 9 wrote:What i can say is p3 sound better in term of tonality, musicality and right/correct than ls5/12a. But it is my own experience you may feel another way. what i trying to say is who need a true harbeth sound shd not consider the ls5/12a.

Maybe one man's meat is another man's poison. When i last have a listening session at Steven's place (use gear seller), the LS5/12a driven with the ML was pretty impressive (big & wide sound stage, mid range to die for, there was some clean & impressive bass from the smallish book shelf) ... aye, it might not have the harbeth sound but P3 is definitely not in the same league with LS5/12A. IMHO only.
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Post by SHL-5 on Sun Jan 08, 2012 1:53 pm

alfred wrote:u mean the p3 would have a bigger soundstage then the 5/12a, a richer mid voice then it, with deeper bass control then the 5/12a and the p3 would sound smoother then 5/12a?

Hi Alfred,

What Mahler 9 is trying to say is that the 5/12 does not bear any resemblance to the typical BBC or Harbeth sound where accuracy of tone, timbre & musicality is highly prized. He's not implying that the P3 have a bigger soundstage or deeper bass than the 5/12. Its a quality vs quantity thingy. If you want your spks to excel on hifi attributes like big soundstage, super deep & tight bass with highs only bats can hear, then Harbeth is not for you. If you value an honest & true midrange with a highly musical, natural & non fatiguing sound, then this is where Harbeth excels. Having said that, if one likes the 5/12, then he'd be better off buying Dynaudio spks as the 5/12 uses Dynaudio drivers and sounds like a typical Dynaudio.

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Post by gloraglory on Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:52 pm

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Post by kychoo99 on Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:57 pm

SHL-5 wrote:
alfred wrote:u mean the p3 would have a bigger soundstage then the 5/12a, a richer mid voice then it, with deeper bass control then the 5/12a and the p3 would sound smoother then 5/12a?

Hi Alfred,

What Mahler 9 is trying to say is that the 5/12 does not bear any resemblance to the typical BBC or Harbeth sound where accuracy of tone, timbre & musicality is highly prized. He's not implying that the P3 have a bigger soundstage or deeper bass than the 5/12. Its a quality vs quantity thingy. If you want your spks to excel on hifi attributes like big soundstage, super deep & tight bass with highs only bats can hear, then Harbeth is not for you. If you value an honest & true midrange with a highly musical, natural & non fatiguing sound, then this is where Harbeth excels. Having said that, if one likes the 5/12, then he'd be better off buying Dynaudio spks as the 5/12 uses Dynaudio drivers and sounds like a typical Dynaudio.

Dear SHL5, just out of curiosity and since you are saying that most typical Dynaudio speaker can produce sound similar to that of a LS5/12A - would appreciate it if you can recommended one of such Dynaudio book shelves (with sound and price matching the LS5/12A) as i am too looking for such smallish speaker with such 'Hifi attributes'. FYI, i too have listen to a number of Dynaudio speaker under RM10k before but sadly couldn't find one with such sound. Thanks in advance for your guidance.

One man's meat is another man's poison = one man called it airy high while another called it highs that only a bats can hear = one man called it natural & non fatiguing sound but another man find it dull & lifeless. That's life ... Wink
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Post by SHL-5 on Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:14 pm

Hi kychoo99,

Afaik, the 5/12 uses similar drivers as the Dynaudio BM series. Probably a BM5? The old contour series should also be similar.

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Post by fizi on Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:18 pm

khlim_77 wrote:Hi fizi
I going to collect my 44 & 405 soon , how can i check this vintage amp especially on the cap part ?
Merry christmas to all harbeth fan

Hi khlim....any new updates on ur new amplifications Very Happy
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