Phono stage with balance out ?

Anyone can share their knowledge ? The balance out in phono stage is "real" balance ? Do we have balance out catridge in the market ?

As far as I know all cartridges are balanced and comprises of 2 coils; one for each channel. That is why there are 4 colour coded wires on every cartridge. It is at the phono stage or preamp that the signal is converted from balanced to single ended.

My 2 cents worth.

Thanks

Simple u can check with vu meter...balance out .

As far as I know all cartridges are balanced and comprises of 2 coils; one for each channel. That is why there are 4 colour coded wires on every cartridge. It is at the phono stage or preamp that the signal is converted from balanced to single ended.

But look at my SME arm, it only has a pair of RCA out, which translate to unbalance out ? Thats y surprise to see the Frank Pipit 22 has RCA in with balance out. I wonder how the topology is..

Hi wabun,

If I'm not wrong, u may u a chip to invert the signer to make it balance.

Hi wabun,

If I'm not wrong, u may u a chip to invert the signer to make it balance..

Then it is not true balance mode. True balance mode like the one use by Krell do not invert any signal, it has "dual RCA" topology which process the +ve and - ve signal concurrently. So far I have't come across any balance interconnect for T/T catridge, mostly RCA.. thats why curious and see if any sifu here use b4..

Just because the cable ends in a phono jack, it does not necessarily mean that the signal is a single ended one. My assertion is still correct, in that the cartridge output is balanced.

The shield in a single ended phono cable as in the Rega is not referenced to ground, but is left floating.

Most decent tonearms and their accompanying cabling come with a separate ground wire.

Thanks

In response to the most recent post, a single ended to balanced converter can be implemented either by transformers or an active circuit.

If you were to study the vacuum state electronics scheatic for the balanced preamp, you will find that the signal from the phono is balanced all the way up to the volume pot and the following circuit for the line stage.

It is only at the output that it is converted to either single ended or it can be left as balanced.


As far as I know Audio Research in their top of the range dedicated phono preamps do run a balanced input and output. I may be wrong.

Thanks

The shield in a single ended phono cable as in the Rega is not referenced to ground, but is left floating.

Most decent tonearms and their accompanying cabling come with a separate ground wire.

You got a point, my doubt cleared. Thanks guys

This might help clarify further...

origin live discovery phono preamp is fully balanced.

from its website:

Balanced configuration

The advantages of a balanced phono stage are extremely compelling, both in theory and auditioning. Using a balanced preamp with a phono cartridge makes a lot of sense for the same reason it makes a lot of sense to use it with a microphone: immunity from noise. The output signal from a cartridge is almost negligible compared to the signal levels coming from a tuner or CD player. Consequently, the gain (amplification level) is very high in a phono preamp. Such high levels of amplification mean that an unbalanced preamp also amplifies the noise signal from the cartridge and arm leads to relatively high levels. Contrastingly this unwanted noise is completely eliminated in a balanced system.

An additional advantage of balanced circuits is the ability to suppress much of their own power supply noise. At each stage of the circuit, the power supply noise is treated as a common mode signal and ignored.

Balanced configuration does not necessitate the use of XLR plugs on your arm leads - you can continue to use your normal RCA phono plugs as these give a fully balanced signal - you only need to connect your arm earth lead or the earth from any arm cable screening to the earth terminal provided on the Origin Live phono stage.

To gain the full benefits of balanced configuration it is best to use a balanced pre-amp / power amp. However, if you do not have balanced amplifiers you will still gain benefits from a balanced phono stage. It is worth noting that a balanced phono stage represents a good future proof investment because if you upgrade to balanced amplifiers later, you will save the expense of changing your phono stage.

One of the truly great things about the Origin Live Discovery phono stage is that it uses fully balanced RCA input sockets, rather than XLRs for the tonearm cable inputs. This has the advantage that you will not need to change your arm plugs to XLR ( as you do with some balanced phono stages).


hope this helps...

Dear all

I am looking for an Phono Stage option for my Phono Kuzma Stabi S + Tonearm Stogi. The Tonearm is wired by Cardas XLR cables. I am looking for an affordable Phono Stage that coud bring me the best result. So far I have already evaluated the AQ Vox with Input/Output balanced XLR conectors. Many other options/brands have only the output balanced or none of them balanced. Would be reasonable simply to convert the Tonearm XLR Conectrs into a RCA Conectors to plug in my Tonearm in the Phono Stage RCA inputs? Could you suggest others fully balanced Phono Stage models with similar prices to AQ Vox taking into consideration we do not have any dealer for AQ Vox in Brazil nor in US?

Thanks.

Raimundo

Hey Rai,
There is a certain 'local' phono pre that offers balance out. Prices I think is 'reasonable'. Try AIME.

Erm... John, Raimundo is located in Brazil so he is limited to international brands.

Ooops...need new glasses! Erm....why not?...interested in AIME? PM me!

Waaaa.... International poisoning....

I've always thought of wanting to convert to XLR balanced cables, at least one time for the sake of DIY and just about too long all my TT's are single ended. Lately I've been facinated on the idea of balanced phono and perhaps its very soon I'd like to put it into practice and reap potential benefit. Microphone or MC cartridge have so much similarity in its cabling and make perfect sense, just that I think manufacturers just don't want more complications, simpler hook up for most practical and economical purpose.
Of course one will need a phono stage balanced input for a start. Since the tonearm wiring and external wiring is custom DIY together with my MC step-ups (single ended for the time being), that won't stop me from going further with balanced cables and XLR inputs, exactly how pro microphones are always rigged up. It makes just perfect sense for the conversion to XLR balanced inputs to phono stage. Good mic cables are easily available at Pasar Rd and Canare mic cables come to mind. Trouble is one its converted, it'll be limited to phono stages with XLR sockets and won't fit other non balanced input phono's if you intend to play around with them at another time. I learnt from somewhere that the Linn T-cable is actually a economy Mogami MICROPHONE type cable. Surely Linn doesn't simply put out nonsense stuff. I'm going to embark on this balanced route in good time. Doesn't cost a lot and its going to be fun.

Interesting! Keep us posted cmboy.

Thanks everybody

I have aleady found a local brand (Sunrise) phono stage with balanced output, very good price/performance, by the way. The problem is that I am looking for a fully balanced phono stage with input and output XLR sockets.

Raimundo