DAC Opinions

mr finger, its yamaha right? i thought theres a new prtnership between yamaha & yokohama thus creating new emerging brands yahama . anyway theres heaps of dac in the market nowdays. you can even try out second hand but good quality dacs like audio alchemy & such. dont waste money on new cdp, your universal player yamaha is good enough i reckon, cheers

Yup....and a good thumping one that is. Not cap ayam jalan pasar kind of dvd player. Go det the DAC dude. You already have a good transport there.

If u have budget, go buy bimmerman's ML 36s dac...
Me too a fan of ML dac, but after I built up my upgrade version of sds lab PCM63 base tube dac with direct transformer output, now got no intention on ML anymore. My sifu even selling of his ML dac no. 30.6...

Finger,

I currently have (for about a week) a locally produced DAC from the maverick Nicholas Chua of Promintheus Audio, albeit a 'Tube DAC' plus USB. You can check out their web page to check out the innards with all the audiophile-grade goodies (of the solid state DAC) plus a pair of Amprex Bugle Boy contributing-in only for this tubey version. The unit comes with separate power supply and weigh in about >10 kg for a DAC!!

I'm running a comparo at the moment with a Benchmark DAC1 and the Azur 840C with a Simaudio Equinox as transport.

I'd post some photos when I get the OK from Nicholas as we are still keeping in touch to 'tune' this beauty and is only the second unit produced to date.

I believe a fellow forummer here has the 1st unit when I auditioned it around Christmas last year. Anyway, give this unit a go or may be can consider when I put the DAC1 for sale soon

Cheers,

zeebee

zeebee wrote:Finger,


I'm running a comparo at the moment with a Benchmark DAC1 and the Azur 840C with a Simaudio Equinox as transport.

How does these two compare? How do you find the sound quality of the 840C?

Would appreciate your feedback.

Regards

Well from all the feedback given I guess I'll probably go for a DAC for sure.
Where can I get these DAC you guys mentioned.
I'm only able to afford somewhere around 1K region at the moment.
What are my choices?

Get the Audio Alchemy DAC in the box in sales thread la. Way below your budget hehe.

any other recommendations?

if it doesnt hurt your pocket, why not try the emerging brand that are discussed in here. they do look tempting, if i were i would go for audition & try as many names before buying.

Finger.....

If budget is a primary constraint then the DAC's from the emerging market or some locally made units is your choice or another option is go with a "Yaqin Tube Buffer" which would cost you RM450 for a new unit or even lesser for a used unit.

I have a Tube buffer in between my CDP and Amp and its a vast difference.

Word of advice before you dive into getting a DAC check out the specification be it for a new unit or used.

You can check out Amcorp Mall at Level 2, they do carry DAC's from China.


cheers

I already lend him my Yaqin tube buffer and he doesn't like it a bit. Weird dude

Pls guys, if your system is good, u don't really need a tube buffer....

arremie wrote:I already lend him my Yaqin tube buffer and he doesn't like it a bit. Weird dude

That's ruled out of the equation, so its the DAC-way...

If possible lug your CDP for the audition as well. Enjoy the hunt..... .


cheers

noodle88 wrote:Pls guys, if your system is good, u don't really need a tube buffer....

I believed my SS system is pretty good but still I like the sound with the buffer. IMHO, the tube is not about improving but rather offering alternate listening experience. Some like it and some don't

noodle88 wrote:Pls guys, if your system is good, u don't really need a tube buffer....

Fortunately the buffer makes a difference in my system which are all non tubey gear.

No sure how far this is justified but it makes no difference with a Tube Amp, which I read in many forums but suprisingly one forummer vouched that it enhances his Tube Amp output and if i am not mistaken its a Bewitch Amp.

Well, believe everyone has their personal take on the various HiFi gear thats out there in the market.

cheers

I recently visited the shop and only found the Belmondo DAC there. Are there any other places? Ideally thought I would like to get something in the GD-Audio range.

Cheers.

wingman wrote:Finger.....

If budget is a primary constraint then the DAC's from the emerging market or some locally made units is your choice or another option is go with a "Yaqin Tube Buffer" which would cost you RM450 for a new unit or even lesser for a used unit.

I have a Tube buffer in between my CDP and Amp and its a vast difference.

Word of advice before you dive into getting a DAC check out the specification be it for a new unit or used.

You can check out Amcorp Mall at Level 2, they do carry DAC's from China.


cheers

wingman wrote:

noodle88 wrote:Pls guys, if your system is good, u don't really need a tube buffer....

Fortunately the buffer makes a difference in my system which are all non tubey gear.

No sure how far this is justified but it makes no difference with a Tube Amp, which I read in many forums but suprisingly one forummer vouched that it enhances his Tube Amp output and if i am not mistaken its a Bewitch Amp.

Well, believe everyone has their personal take on the various HiFi gear thats out there in the market.

cheers

Wingman,

Tube gear can only sound gud if it has a good circuitry n superb power supply. I don't see your tube buffer have a very good power supply. I do own a tube buffer, I'm using it as a phase invertor for my DVD player. As I know almost all DVD output r inverted. As I can't invert the phase of my Bose system, I use a buffer. For Hifi, if your dac n preamp r up to date, putting a buffer in between will degrade your sound quality. Unless u r using interconnect that longer than 2m .

noodle88 wrote:

wingman wrote:

noodle88 wrote:Pls guys, if your system is good, u don't really need a tube buffer....

Fortunately the buffer makes a difference in my system which are all non tubey gear.

No sure how far this is justified but it makes no difference with a Tube Amp, which I read in many forums but suprisingly one forummer vouched that it enhances his Tube Amp output and if i am not mistaken its a Bewitch Amp.

Well, believe everyone has their personal take on the various HiFi gear thats out there in the market.

cheers

Wingman,

Tube gear can only sound gud if it has a good circuitry n superb power supply. I don't see your tube buffer have a very good power supply. I do own a tube buffer, I'm using it as a phase invertor for my DVD player. As I know almost all DVD output r inverted. As I can't invert the phase of my Bose system, I use a buffer. For Hifi, if your dac n preamp r up to date, putting a buffer in between will degrade your sound quality. Unless u r using interconnect that longer than 2m .

Are you saying this because you have actually heard & listened to wingman's system in real life and confirmed with your very own ears that the tube buffer is killing the sound, or are you just shooting motherhood statements as per your usual modus operandi ?

finger wrote:Well from all the feedback given I guess I'll probably go for a DAC for sure.
Where can I get these DAC you guys mentioned.
I'm only able to afford somewhere around 1K region at the moment.
What are my choices?

@finger, if u r considering a DAC, just to let u know that Used units from Audio-Alchemy like the higher-end models called "DDE" series in the
Audio-Alchemy range are going for about RM300~500 in the used market.

Their DAc-in-a-box was the absolutest lowest entry model that was offered from AA before the company winded up.

Also, you should know that since the company is no longer
around... so don't expect any kind of factory service in case some
critical component becomes faulty. Although there are some schematics flying around the Internet for some of its DAC and DTI models.

Brand new Entry-level DACs u can consider would be Musical Fidelity's V-DAC, and Cambridge Audio's DACMagic. All for around RM1+K. U get full warranty, and even some "nice to have computer-audiophile" features like USB ports and upsampling capabilities.

If you're maverick enough, can even go for a Behringer SRC2496 which is a very versatile DAC, but it also does more than just DAC duties coz it can also act as a Sample Rate Converter (change whatever incoming digital format to whatever outgoing format), and also as an ADC (yes, digitise your LPs and be a home-brew LP pirate...ahem ahem). Street price in MY, approx RM 1.2~1.4K only. Cheap cheap good good.

Wah, a rm450 tube buffer can do miricle??? 1 for mugenfoo pls......

psychoacoustics?

LOL

noodle88 wrote:Wah, a rm450 tube buffer can do miricle??? 1 for mugenfoo pls......

Well, could be the same way like how your RM4.50/ft AC orange powercord cable can do "miricle" also lah.... right?

noodle88 wrote:If u r into diy Hifi , u may find a RM 1 upgrade in
your system may make big big different. As u go higher end, the more
sensitive your system will be. It would have a bigger jump when u have a
rm75000 system compare to rm50k system. Everything will make big
different.

And if u say RM1 tweak can give improvement in DIY system, whats wrong
with RM450 device in some other people's system that you most evidently HAVE NOT EVEN LISTENED TO yourself?

...but someone here seems to have learned all there is to know about hifi already So tube buffers to him are a write-off case for sure already.

WongKN wrote:As I was saying like a broken record, it pays to keep an
open mind and be willing to learn new things all the time !

i made an AB comparison with yaqin ms12b & AA ditb. I use side by side inputs to hear the difference. using marantz cd67 as source & yamaha A760 mark II drives the speakon. 'to be natural' i use source direct button. the result was, AA provides good mids, the bass is punchy, suitable for hard musiks like rock or pop, while ms12b works better for jazz (be it bebop, smooth, etc) & classical. its warm tube sound translate the musiks to different level. i keep both settings for my own listening pleasure as i can go as hard as napalm death & gojira, or as soft as jim tomlinson & dave brubeck or david murray.. cheers

Good call. I just use my AVR when playing Metallica. With tube amp they sounded too "romantic" lol

arremie wrote:Good call. I just use my AVR when playing Metallica. With tube amp they sounded too "romantic" lol

... wait till u hear Metallica being played by via a:

Noodle.....

Aiyahhh......

My primary gear and CDP put together are really aged more then 10 years. With the aged circuit design and adding the Tube buffer a present design has given the "zing" back. Shall i say a shot of "Viagra" for an old gear to re-kindle the moods..... and some . Possibilty .... , I would think so... but other's may think the opposite..... .

As you have experienced yourself, it works perfectly fine with a inverted circuit setup but it may not jive with present design Hifi gear with all the enchancements and tweaks built in.....

Like wise, changing the stock power cords to the ACE 14AWG powercords has tighten the output and falling back to the stock power cables gives it a laid back output.... . ( thanks to you for the ACE PCable intrduction )

I would not discount your views or for the matter anyone in this forum as its a view point that may help me when i enchance my gear.

So the above two works fine with my setup and may not work wonders in another setup or may not work all together

It's a "Holy Grail" to an individual persons desire / liking.. shally i say

Finger.....

Mugen and other forummers have laid out the various DAC's within your reach with some top up options.

You would need to match that "one" DAC that matches your overall gear.

Hunt begins..... .....

cheers

one day i will make krell sings my harmony corruption!!

Wingman,

I have no issue with your 10 years old equipment, my Marrantz cd99 transport is almost 15 years old...

Do be carefull with your tube buffer, some buffer is phase inverted, check out with the dealer, if it's inverted. If it's inverted, u need to invert your speaker cable at the speaker side.

I do come across people sucessfully impliment tube buffer in their Hifi system. But his buffer is with super power supply, dual mono power supply, tube rectifier, tube regulator, black gate wkz smoothing cap, vcap as coupling cap.
It's almost like a good tube preamp. He use tube preamp to drive his Ss amp.

What plug r u using for the ace powercord? Uk? Us? If u use mk 13a power plug, u may try out various fuse ie, mk made in uk, bussmann made in uk, mk normal, bussmann normal, unlead fuse, 10A , 5A, 8A fuse. All of them have diffent sound, see which suits your system most. Hahaha...
Try until u 'gila'.....


Cheers,

Thanks a lot guys, will get on my feet next week and start of with some listening.

Noodle....

Like wise, no worries.

Most of my gear are on "MK" Hospital grade plugs with the std Bussman fuse except for the Buffer on Standard bulky "MK" plug. For now that would suffice for my listening pleasure.

Tinkering on my next project............

cheers

Wingman,

U need to be careful, for me standard MK plug is always better than the hospital grade ones. Belive me or not?

after waiting so long, finally decided to go for Teralink X2.

will ge getting it soon and there goes the PCHIFI with 8x1704UK Dac.

Noodle.....

Why is that so...

Have both the MK Hospital and the MK Std plug ( similar to the MK Hospital plug dimension ), the difference between both is one has a softer outer shell and silver live connecter and the other has a hard outer shell and silver fuse holder bracket attached to copper legs.

Anyway, i got the MK Hospital grade plugs from across the border at a fairly reasonable price.

cheers

Yep Mr Noodle... very interesting, care to share your secret.

wingman wrote:Noodle.....

Why is that so...

Have both the MK Hospital and the MK Std plug ( similar to the MK Hospital plug dimension ), the difference between both is one has a softer outer shell and silver live connecter and the other has a hard outer shell and silver fuse holder bracket attached to copper legs.

Anyway, i got the MK Hospital grade plugs from across the border at a fairly reasonable price.

cheers

BTW Wingman... which border you are referring to, north or south .

Cheers n have a nice day..

Zee....

That would be the southern end........

Got them during the yearly sale..........bout 2 years back....still wanting to get a few more ....for my other electrical items......

cheers

Have u guys ever try the made in uk bussmann or mk 13a fuse? They r the best. Do your best to find it, it worth the efford. Try to get it from old old mk plug, they r the best. It's just like u change to a much better tube....

Happy searching.....Hahaha......

Wingman ,

The interest part about the standard mk plug is the big screw cable holder n the solid ceremic outer base. The hospital grade r a bit soft.

For me, STD MK plug with bussmann made in uk fuse is the best ....

I put my poweramp nearest to the power inlet n my transport futhest away from inlet. Dac n preamp in between. My dac will be nearer to transport n preamp will be nearer to poweramp. U may try this one....

Mr Noodles, through my own listening i've found the opposite to be true. US plugs sound better than UK plugs on my system. On my power distributor, I put digital sources nearer to the power inlet followed by amplification. This way the digital sources get less power "corruption" if I may and then when the slightly "corrupted" power reaches the amp, it won't really mind the corruption as much as digital sources. Well, to each his own.

bimmerman wrote:Mr Noodles, through my own listening i've found the opposite to be true. US plugs sound better than UK plugs on my system.

Probably on most system as well.

bimmerman wrote:Mr Noodles, through my own listening i've found the opposite to be true. US plugs sound better than UK plugs on my system. On my power distributor, I put digital sources nearer to the power inlet followed by amplification. This way the digital sources get less power "corruption" if I may and then when the slightly "corrupted" power reaches the amp, it won't really mind the corruption as much as digital sources. Well, to each his own.

I truly have to agree with this statement...

dixchen wrote:

bimmerman wrote:Mr Noodles, through my own listening i've found the opposite to be true. US plugs sound better than UK plugs on my system. On my power distributor, I put digital sources nearer to the power inlet followed by amplification. This way the digital sources get less power "corruption" if I may and then when the slightly "corrupted" power reaches the amp, it won't really mind the corruption as much as digital sources. Well, to each his own.

I truly have to agree with this statement...

Oh not to mentioned I could not find a diff between UK or US plugs, really did not find a difference between both styles.

It's all in their mind

if you shorten the power cords then maybe theres a logic behind this (i think). but if distance between equipment & power inlet can influence dirtiness i dont see the logic. ermmmmm pls enlight encik bimmer & noodle

dixchen wrote:

dixchen wrote:

bimmerman wrote:Mr Noodles, through my own listening i've found the opposite to be true. US plugs sound better than UK plugs on my system. On my power distributor, I put digital sources nearer to the power inlet followed by amplification. This way the digital sources get less power "corruption" if I may and then when the slightly "corrupted" power reaches the amp, it won't really mind the corruption as much as digital sources. Well, to each his own.

I truly have to agree with this statement...

Oh not to mentioned I could not find a diff between UK or US plugs, really did not find a difference between both styles.

I could tell you why you don't hear a difference but you might hate me. So I won't and we can all be friends.

azri wrote:if you shorten the power cords then maybe theres a logic behind this (i think). but if distance between equipment & power inlet can influence dirtiness i dont see the logic. ermmmmm pls enlight encik bimmer & noodle

I'd like to say I have the answer you're looking for but i'd be lying. But the next time it rains, look at the water gushing in the longkang. Then look at other longkangs of different widths and lengths and see how it effects the turbulance in the flow. Something like that bro. But i'm only making this one up.

bimmerman wrote:

dixchen wrote:

dixchen wrote:

bimmerman wrote:Mr Noodles, through my own listening i've found the opposite to be true. US plugs sound better than UK plugs on my system. On my power distributor, I put digital sources nearer to the power inlet followed by amplification. This way the digital sources get less power "corruption" if I may and then when the slightly "corrupted" power reaches the amp, it won't really mind the corruption as much as digital sources. Well, to each his own.

I truly have to agree with this statement...

Oh not to mentioned I could not find a diff between UK or US plugs, really did not find a difference between both styles.

I could tell you why you don't hear a difference but you might hate me. So I won't and we can all be friends.

No worries dude...

Dixchen , u don't find any different may be u have by pass the fuse in the uk plug....

Hey guys, Its all about noise control, how u ground your equipment. My guru told me to put the most noise equipment nearest to the power inlet so that all the noise that we domp into our noise ground n rf ground can have a shorter path to earth n does not interfear with other equipment. For me my amp is the noisest n I put it nearest to the power inlet.

We need speed from our preamp, the faster the better. So I put it nearer to my poweramp.....

I don't want my cdt to be very fast n they r less noisy, I put them futher away. Further away also means longer power cord. These make different.

noodle88 wrote:Dixchen , u don't find any different may be u have by pass the fuse in the uk plug....

Hey guys, Its all about noise control, how u ground your equipment. My guru told me to put the most noise equipment nearest to the power inlet so that all the noise that we domp into our noise ground n rf ground can have a shorter path to earth n does not interfear with other equipment. For me my amp is the noisest n I put it nearest to the power inlet.

We need speed from our preamp, the faster the better. So I put it nearer to my poweramp.....

I don't want my cdt to be very fast n they r less noisy, I put them futher away. Further away also means longer power cord. These make different.

IF you are referencing to ground then, then what you just said makes a lot of sense...each equipment we have do dump noise back via the ground. But I think the reason why I did not feel it is that I never ever share my connections between amps and sources such as preamp and the cd/dac units on the same distribution blocks. Both completely isolated.

Yea you're right I don't run the fuses inside the plugs..

Having said that I only switch my source equipments around along the power distribution blocks to have the quietest noise floor amongst each equipment.

Probably should connect my Sony transports on the last connector of the block.... though they are not affected by noise ( no grounding to the connector thus the quietest) I find them rather fast at times.

How do you define whether a source is fast or not?