Re: Naim Audio - discussion thread

[Chewkw]

Code:

Hi all,

Not very sure with this, is it possible to biamping with hicap but without Naxo? How does naxo works anyway?

Thanks.


Yes, hicap can be plug up with 2 power amp. Supercap can be plug up with 3 power amp.

Noxo is Naim Audio Active crossover.
If you need to use the Naxo2-4(for 2way speaker) or Naso3-6(for 3way speaker) you will need hicap or supercap for power supply. Also you need to remove the passive crossover from the speaker unit.

That mean Noxo2-4 is for biwamp or 4mono amp.
Noxo3-6 is for triamp or 6mono amp.

[roger15ohm]

Thanks Chew!! Looks like a huge investment and big project to use Naxo. By the way, anyone can recommend me suitable speaker for my set besides then LinnKan (quite hard to find) and Roger (too cost dearly)? I am looking for bookshelf budget btw 2 to 3k - pre own please. I still have my generic (foundation look) speaker stand. I would also prefer bi wiring to toy with bi amping in future. Tq.

[mofaz]

Naim price going up end of March 2012 ..

[roger15ohm]

Does anyone owned Neil Naim 321/729 Upgrade Cards for 32.5 and 72.5? I have Avondale 821 and Jumper for exchange loaning programme.. Thanks.

[lewah63]

I am considering the following CD player upgrade options:-

a) Naim CD5XS

b) Naim DAC with present Creek Evolution as transport

Current set up is as follows:-

CD : Creek Evolution

Amplifier : Naim NAC152XS + NAP155XS

Speaker : Proac Studio 140MKII

Any suggestion / recomendation? Anyone currently using Naim DAC?

Thank you.

[perlis1977]

Basis on your options, I will suggest to dispose off the Creek Evolution CD and get Naim CD5XS, which will be better option then (2). If you prefer to option (2), then you require bringing the Creek CD to dealer place, and connecting to Naim DAC, then perform a serious audition (as I have not hear Creek sound before). Only when you like the combination in term of sound reproduction (Naim DAC with Creek), then decide to buy. Of cause, if matching with ALL Naim components (Naim CD5XS + pre/power of XS) will be better in term of PRAT.

Btw, since you have good entry pre/power system, would suggest, if possible, get a Flepcap 2X or Flapcap 2XS first to give more power to your pre/power combination, you will definitely like the true Naim sound.

Enjoy your music !

[mofaz]

If you go for option 2 ..for sure you'd end up buying the CD5XS to replace the Creek CD player in a couple of months because it's not a Naim ..

[lewah63]

Basis on your options, I will suggest to dispose off the Creek Evolution CD and get Naim CD5XS, which will be better option then (2). If you prefer to option (2), then you require bringing the Creek CD to dealer place, and connecting to Naim DAC, then perform a serious audition (as I have not hear Creek sound before). Only when you like the combination in term of sound reproduction (Naim DAC with Creek), then decide to buy. Of cause, if matching with ALL Naim components (Naim CD5XS + pre/power of XS) will be better in term of PRAT.

Btw, since you have good entry pre/power system, would suggest, if possible, get a Flepcap 2X or Flapcap 2XS first to give more power to your pre/power combination, you will definitely like the true Naim sound.

Enjoy your music !

Thank you for your recomendation.

I have already got a Flapcap in my set up.

The idea of DAC is for better future upgrade and flexibility for connection to digital sources such as media player / CAS etc.

The problem is not sure how is Creek perform when match with NDAC...

[lewah63]

If you go for option 2 ..for sure you'd end up buying the CD5XS to replace the Creek CD player in a couple of months because it's not a Naim ..

Any problem if a transport is not a Naim? Perhap future can upgrade the transport but not necessary Naim...

Anyone has used NDAC with non-Naim transport?

[scubanasa]

Agreed with mofaz , 99% you will have both CD5 XS + nDAC. Provided when $$$ is not a problem to you .

On paper, no doubt that Naim DAC is better than CD5 XS. IMHO, adding nDAC into the system is consider a source upgrade. Then, think about changing the transport at a later stage.

Perhaps, you can arrange with CMY for a demo with your Creek Evo? Trust you ears bro.

Good Luck.

[Mikapoh]

There is no problem whatsoever to use non-naim transport to feed into nDAC. The transport does not necessary have to be Naim but nDAC is sensitive to what transport to partner to explore its full potential. Many UK naim owners have used other brand as transport to great result. That said, different transport gives different sound quality. Let your ears choose the right one for you.

If not mistaken, nDAC does not work directly with computer/laptop too. It also does not support Flac files. (correct me if I'm wrong). Common device to stream to the DAC is squeezebox Touch.

[Naim_Audio]

nDAC is a good DAC,does anyone had compare head to head with Benchmark DAC before?

[lewah63]

Thanks for all the feedback.
Other options are Nd5xs and Benchmark.
But not sure how is Benchmark compare with ndac.
Btw which shop in KL selling Benchmark?
How is nd5xs compare with ndac?

[Mikapoh]

nDAC is a good DAC,does anyone had compare head to head with Benchmark DAC before?

nDAC is indeed a very established DAC but having marketed in that price range, few other rivals can give stiff competition as well. But if you have naim set-up, it is no brainer addition to your system :-)

[lewah63]

Ndac is preferred option as compare to others dac. Due to budget constraints not sure can live with present cd player as transport while waiting for transport upgrade. If no obvious improvement over the present set up with ndac then it will be great dissapointment.

[crittertoo]

no point speculating about nDac. Go to CMY, they will be more than please to hook up your CD player to the nDac. my naim's are still running in and they are sounding superb..

enjoy the nDac.

[Mikapoh]

no point speculating about nDac. Go to CMY, they will be more than please to hook up your CD player to the nDac. my naim's are still running in and they are sounding superb..

enjoy the nDac.

Congrat on your purchase. Care to share what are your new naim boxes?

Naim will sound superb during running in period but become exquisite few months later :=)

BTW, all prices will increase by next month.

[lewah63]

no point speculating about nDac. Go to CMY, they will be more than please to hook up your CD player to the nDac. my naim's are still running in and they are sounding superb..

enjoy the nDac.

Mind to share what transport are you using?

[crittertoo]

i am using the uniti ssd...it's a loan unit for testing. Have not decided yet. UnitiSSD/nDac/282/250. The other option would be aurrender s10/nDac but that will have to wait till next tues.

the unitissd/nDac imho is a bit to forward at times but the PRAT factor is SUPERB!!! Just wondering if the nDac would sound better with the XPS ps....mmm

mikapoh - i am running unitissd/nDac/282-hicap/250 with hi-line and power-line.

[Mikapoh]

crittertoo, I read your words. You have built around a serious sounding system. At meantime, just enjoy your music.

[crittertoo]

mikapoh - it is nice, but sometimes the highs are too forward when i crank her up (it's not edgy or rough)...it is just too forward, maybe somemore breaking in would be in order. I have left her running 24/7 for a week now, hopefully i get there fast!!!! : )

Just tried the frank tchang liveline powercables, man, they sure put a kick into the overall system, the timing is incredible, the kick drums, the plucking of guitars all came alive but I lost a tad of my lower end. It just does not get the lows like the black mamba powercables. Decided to keep the black mambas.

If you like the KICK in your system, the liveline powercables are for you!!!

[crittertoo]

i have sucumb to the HDX. She is now being run in... HDX/NDAC really rocks me world!!!

[leofric32]

Dear all,

I need some advice on the upgrade option that i can consider to my current setup. My setup is nac122/nap150, cd5x, and nd5 xs. My speaker is usher be718-be.

I used to be please with the setup until I move to a larger room, of 22feet by 30feet. I hope i can describe my problem. I felt that the music is very thin and lack of bass. This posses me some doubts, is this problem due to the usher speaker being a bookshelf and not suitable for a larger room. On the other hand from my previous understanding on review, the usher 718 should sound larger than it size. If this is true, could it be nap150 is not enough to drive the usher? Recommendation from my dealer, you know who is to upgrade to nap200.

Of course nap200 is better than my current nap150 but do it worth doing or changing the speaker to floor stander?

What Speaker are you using and is the orator 400 a good choice?

Hope to get some advice from you? Thanks in advance.

[ryder]

Generally small bookshelves will sound small in large rooms with reduced scale and bass extension, sounding just what you have described. The Usher BE-718 is no exception, though some larger monitors with bigger drivers and cabinet may still retain the scale and bass extension to a certain degree.

The upgrade from NAP150 to NAP200 may give you some slight improvements in bass and control, though I don't think it will bring too much of a difference in transforming the BE718 to match the performance in the smaller room. In the smaller room the speakers are able to pressurize it more effectively resulting in a fuller and more dynamic sound and punchier bass. In the larger space, all that is lost as the speaker is unable to pressurize the room.

You can minimise the effects of thin sound and lightweight bass by sitting closer to the speakers. Perhaps a near to midfield arrangement with a listening distance of not more than 8' from the speakers. If that doesn't work, a larger floorstander may be a better option than upgrading to the NAP200. Nevertheless, big speakers usually will present more acoustic problems - uncontrolled bass = headaches. If lucky one may be able to get away with severe bass issues without treating the room.

[leofric32]

Hi Ryder,

Thanks your your valuable input and explanation. I do suspect that the 718 can't fill my larger room size. So let say I decided to go for a floorstander, it seems like I also need to upgrade my power amp to drive the speaker more efficiently.

Any good recommendation on floor stander that better match with naim. I am more of an all rounder in music genre, pop, vocal, jazz, instrumental, etc, depending n the time I play and listen to the music.

[ryder]

Hi leofric32,

It depends on the efficiency of the speaker as those with high sensitivity will work fine with modestly powered amps and may not require an amp upgrade. As far as I know there are some folks who are using Nait 5i and XS to drive the Ovator S400 on the Naim forum.

Speaker selection is a very personal thing. It will be good if you can listen to a few to see which one will suit your listening preferences best. The Ovator S400s seem to be an all-rounder but may not suit everyone's taste, though they were said to be quite room friendly. Perhaps others may provide some recommendations on suitable speakers.

[Mikapoh]

Neat Motive 2, Kudos X2 or C2 are among the quality floorstanders that are said to match heavenly with Naim gears especially the XS Series. I would very keen to home demo Kudos X2 with XS amps. I have read many feedback that when they pair together, the sound from this combo is hard to resist at their price range!

On your amplification, I would strongly suggest to forget the NAP200. No doubt that it is a very good power amp but like it or not, your pre-amp is the bottleneck and will limit greatly your system full potential. In fact, your source (CD5X & ND5XS) have been quite maxed out which is a good thing to start with. Your pre-amp NAC122 will still be considered the weakest link. I would look at minimum NAC155xs to match with NAP150. You will be surprised to find the music will flow with better punch or energy even by a better matching pre-amp in the mix. In the context of Naim, many owners will opt for higher source or pre-amp than the power amp.

Hope this helps.

[leofric32]

Thanks for your valuable insights. It does help. It seems like it is going to be an interesting journey on my next upgrade.

[1541]

A direct next upgrade to Nac102/202 will rewards you a many years of pleasant ride on Naims journey.

[leofric32]

Just upgraded to 202/200. Another milestone in my journey to feel good factor ... Next will be the speaker to floor stander. And yet sonus faber still my favourite....

Anyone has good experience in pair both naim and sonus?

[shslpg]

Wow... Spend lots on this jump/upgrade.. I think the next still adding a cap rather then changing the current speaker. A hicap/supercap can make a very huge different in sound. At the moment, enjoy your current setup up first for more than 3 months then only think of upgrade.

[Mikapoh]

Hi naimees

Here is the sneak preview of FraimLite in cherry & black finishing.




Just bought myself 3 tiers FraimLite to accommodate my Naim gears. Immediately after installation, hearing the system plays once again is a revelation. The rack does a believable job in cleaning the overall sound that resulted in more details flowing through, much easier to follow the music notes. The improved in dynamic swing especially the drums sound is more pronounced and everything sound more control.

Before this, I am quite skeptical what an equipment support can do to our system sound. Nevertheless, I believe all Naim gears react VERY positively to all good racks. Try it and you will discover it is an important thing not to be missed in the chain.

[shslpg]

Wow!!! Nice Rack you have there. Now your kits look more handsome and smart. How much u spend on for the rack?

[Mikapoh]

Could not afford the full Fraim so opt for the lite version. It costs identical to a new Nait 5i for base + 2 shelves.

[crittertoo]

Could not afford the full Fraim so opt for the lite version.

It is usually NOT about $$$ I tried the Fraim, used them for like a week and everything sounds so bright until my ears hurts. It does however "opens" up the midrange, the "highs" seems to go on forever which sounds very fake to me.

In the end, I opted for a framelite shelf Great stuff you have there mikapoh

[Mikapoh]

Thanks crittertoo for your comment.

I guess the glass panels in the Fraim has great effect to enhance the high frequency to some extent, in turn possibly makes it more aggressive and forward presentation as opposed to more laid back of the FraimLite. However, this is the first time I heard full fat Fraim is sounding bright ;=)

After installation, I have also ensure cable dressing is done in the best possible way albeit space constraint at the back of the rack. The din cables, snaic, leads and Naca5 are not touching on one another nor the wall & floor. The Din cable is rested on the foam without exerting any stress. I think all these cares do help in the end result.

[crittertoo]

cable dressing IS important. Mine is in a mess currently. Guess I have to clean that up soon. It's such a chore doing cable dressing.

my room acoustic is naturally bright , therefore adding the fraim to the equation is such a no no

[SnowCatZ]

Just got a used Nait 3. My first naim. Liked it very much. I'm using Dynaudio DM 2/7 with it. Dynamics are pretty good.

Was not using the NACA5 at first. Was using my Chord Silver Screen Carnival at 2 meter length. After leaving it on for 3 days. I realized that the sound had pretty much degraded and it really sounded pretty bad!

Quickly borrowed a pair of NACA5 from a friend, connected it and wow.... Everything changed! Pronounce detail, punchy bass and overall better clarity. It feels like the NACA 5 completes the Nait 3.

After listening to it for awhile. I decided to try to play a few rock/metal tracks. I've lost all of my rock/metal CDs. So I decided to download some flac files. Play it tru my media player which transfer digital file to my CDP DAC and output to the Nait. And I'm quite disappointed coz I find that the sound is like a jumble mess. Sigh... Maybe my CDP DAC no good? I'm running Quad 99 CDP. or is it the source? I tried playing Mr Big - Green Tinted Sixties Mind & some tracks by Nirvana.....

Advice bros....

[skydna]

Just got a used Nait 3. My first naim. Liked it very much. I'm using Dynaudio DM 2/7 with it. Dynamics are pretty good.

Was not using the NACA5 at first. Was using my Chord Silver Screen Carnival at 2 meter length. After leaving it on for 3 days. I realized that the sound had pretty much degraded and it really sounded pretty bad!

Quickly borrowed a pair of NACA5 from a friend, connected it and wow.... Everything changed! Pronounce detail, punchy bass and overall better clarity. It feels like the NACA 5 completes the Nait 3.

After listening to it for awhile. I decided to try to play a few rock/metal tracks. I've lost all of my rock/metal CDs. So I decided to download some flac files. Play it tru my media player which transfer digital file to my CDP DAC and output to the Nait. And I'm quite disappointed coz I find that the sound is like a jumble mess. Sigh... Maybe my CDP DAC no good? I'm running Quad 99 CDP. or is it the source? I tried playing Mr Big - Green Tinted Sixties Mind & some tracks by Nirvana.....

Advice bros....

Transport take a very important job in a hifi system, been going through different branded DAC with computer route for a long time but no good result especially playing complicated music like rock as your said jumble mess, once Naim cd player comes in my system finally my system sounded "HIFI". May be you can try burn your Flac in to CD format for your CDP you may get a good result