Ho's LS3/5A monitor users

M7 wrote:A group of hifi kaki of mine have also tried 20 watter Musical Fidelity A1 on the LS3/5A

little bit underpowered, but still sounds very good

not whispering level but normal listening level is OK

ya..is like 600hp ferrari compare to a 100+hp lotus elise. the nimbleness of the handling of lotus elise can be real " racing'' feel.

A lot depends on the kind of music you listen to. For predominantly vocal, especially those with acoustic backing, the Rogers/Spendor/Harbeth series of 'studio monitors' are some of the best one can buy. Supposedly the BBC studio uses them as monitor speakers during their recording and broadcast sessions.

However, for those who listens to more demanding music, or even the no so demanding ones, e.g. Dire Straits, these monitors on their own, especially the LS3/5A can sometimes be found wanting. This is where the matched subwoofer comes in to do wonders. Still, bass 'punch' can be lacking because the small driver just can't move enough air to generate the power needed for say symphony classical pieces.

There is a reason why when people go for the truly high-end, they often end up with larger speakers with large or multiple drivers and which very sadly, also costs the sky to purchase. Listen to speakers like Wilsons, Apogees, Infinitis, Thiels, etc in a properly set-up system to appreciate why.

amen!

the LS3/5A will NEVER be able to properly reproduce The Organ from the Sydney Opera House, nor a Steinway & Sons grand piano, or a Yamaha drumset with Zidjian cymbals and hi-hats. It can't handle the dynamics, it can't replicate the timbre accuracy.

Simply because its was NOT designed to do so.

It was designed for the monitoring of vocals for broadcast applications, and to be portable like in a TV newscasting crew's van.

So, for all intents and purposes , an LS3/5a will just do vocals + some bandwidth-limited & dynamics-limited music content and do it very well.

Any other claims of it being "musical", or even being high-fidelity from the entire 20Hz to 20KHz spectrum, are sadly misplaced.

It's a darn good Mini Cooper, but an aged Mini Cooper nevertheless. Not even close to a present day Honda Civic Type-R.

hopefully can experience something like tubejunkie setup
always curious on sound production hence the low output

Hi,

May I know what base you draw the conclusion below? Mind to tell the LS3/5A system set up you had auditioned?

TQ

mugenfoo wrote:amen!

the LS3/5A will NEVER be able to properly reproduce The Organ from the Sydney Opera House, nor a Steinway & Sons grand piano, or a Yamaha drumset with Zidjian cymbals and hi-hats. It can't handle the dynamics, it can't replicate the timbre accuracy.

Simply because its was NOT designed to do so.

It was designed for the monitoring of vocals for broadcast applications, and to be portable like in a TV newscasting crew's van.

So, for all intents and purposes , an LS3/5a will just do vocals + some bandwidth-limited & dynamics-limited music content and do it very well.

Any other claims of it being "musical", or even being high-fidelity from the entire 20Hz to 20KHz spectrum, are sadly misplaced.

It's a darn good Mini Cooper, but an aged Mini Cooper nevertheless. Not even close to a present day Honda Civic Type-R.

mugenfoo wrote:amen!

the LS3/5A will NEVER be able to properly reproduce The Organ from the Sydney Opera House, nor a Steinway & Sons grand piano, or a Yamaha drumset with Zidjian cymbals and hi-hats. It can't handle the dynamics, it can't replicate the timbre accuracy.

Simply because its was NOT designed to do so.

It was designed for the monitoring of vocals for broadcast applications, and to be portable like in a TV newscasting crew's van.

So, for all intents and purposes , an LS3/5a will just do vocals + some bandwidth-limited & dynamics-limited music content and do it very well.

Any other claims of it being "musical", or even being high-fidelity from the entire 20Hz to 20KHz spectrum, are sadly misplaced.

It's a darn good Mini Cooper, but an aged Mini Cooper nevertheless. Not even close to a present day Honda Civic Type-R.

bro, that's the reason why LP still around.

tubejunkie wrote:

mugenfoo wrote:amen!

the LS3/5A will NEVER be able to properly reproduce The Organ from the Sydney Opera House, nor a Steinway & Sons grand piano, or a Yamaha drumset with Zildjian cymbals and hi-hats. It can't handle the dynamics, it can't replicate the timbre accuracy.

Simply because its was NOT designed to do so.

It was designed for the monitoring of vocals for broadcast applications, and to be portable like in a TV newscasting crew's van.

So, for all intents and purposes , an LS3/5a will just do vocals + some bandwidth-limited & dynamics-limited music content and do it very well.

Any other claims of it being "musical", or even being high-fidelity from the entire 20Hz to 20KHz spectrum, are sadly misplaced.

It's a darn good Mini Cooper, but an aged Mini Cooper nevertheless. Not even close to a present day Honda Civic Type-R.

bro, that's the reason why LP still around.

How are these two related, I tak faham!

rsbn589 wrote:Hi,

May I know what base you draw the conclusion below? Mind to tell the LS3/5A system set up you had auditioned?

TQ

Why ? U got a pair of "super magical" LS3/5a that can do the crescendos of a Steinway and Sons Grand Piano or the attack, bite and slam of Tom Morello's selection of Fenders and Gibsons?

OK, u supply the speakers!!! I supply everything else. I also guarantee you an abundance of electrical juice as delivered from a box that houses a 4KVA toroidal. Guaranteed not to disappoint.


It's a date then ??

tycham wrote:

tubejunkie wrote:

mugenfoo wrote:amen!

the LS3/5A will NEVER be able to properly reproduce The Organ from the Sydney Opera House, nor a Steinway & Sons grand piano, or a Yamaha drumset with Zildjian cymbals and hi-hats. It can't handle the dynamics, it can't replicate the timbre accuracy.

Simply because its was NOT designed to do so.

It was designed for the monitoring of vocals for broadcast applications, and to be portable like in a TV newscasting crew's van.

So, for all intents and purposes , an LS3/5a will just do vocals + some bandwidth-limited & dynamics-limited music content and do it very well.

Any other claims of it being "musical", or even being high-fidelity from the entire 20Hz to 20KHz spectrum, are sadly misplaced.

It's a darn good Mini Cooper, but an aged Mini Cooper nevertheless. Not even close to a present day Honda Civic Type-R.

bro, that's the reason why LP still around.

How are these two related, I tak faham!

That makes 2 of us .. i also tak faham.

??? I'm just asking simple questions but you have not answered me but challege???. I have no intention to challenge your statement but would like to seek clarifications. I have auditioned a very nice LS3/5A+AB1+Sub set up that sound quite all around. Cheers!

mugenfoo wrote:

rsbn589 wrote:Hi,

May I know what base you draw the conclusion below? Mind to tell the LS3/5A system set up you had auditioned?

TQ

Why ? U got a pair of "super magical" LS3/5a that can do the crescendos of a Steinway and Sons Grand Piano or the attack, bite and slam of Tom Morello's selection of Fenders and Gibsons?

OK, u supply the speakers!!! I supply everything else. I also guarantee you an abundance of electrical juice as delivered from a box that houses a 4KVA toroidal. Guaranteed not to disappoint.


It's a date then ??

aisey.... that whatever ls3/5a with subwoofer is cheating one ..... This subwoofer lah, that subwoofer lah, some particular style of subwoofer placements...

As in loudspeakers and in internal combustion engines, the old saying goes: "There is no replacement for displacement".

anyway yes if u want clarifications, i've heard ls3/5a partnered with Audio Research, Jadis, Sonic Frontiers (anyone still remember this brand?) , even some more "down to earth" Audiolabs, Creeks, sugdens.... etc etc.
Rogers, Spendors, and Harbeths being the LS3/5a i have listened to. Spendors being the most time with.

Hi all,
Just to share my "journey" about 3 years ago when I started to put together a set for myself. I was introduced to the hifi world by my colleague having a set of Quad 66-CD, Quad Pre-Amp 34, Quad 306 Power Amp, driving a pair of Harbeth HL-P3. I was amazed. I went hunting starting with speakers in the used market here... cos I heard the HL-P3 ES2 at Tropical & I still like the old HL-P3 better. But I ended with a pair of Rogers 11 ohm LS35a. This pair given me the nightmare of finding a satisfactory amp to drive it..... along the way another pair of HL-P3 came by, I bought it, but found that it is so much easier to find matching amp for it.. & sold it on to my bro. Back to the Rogers LS35a... not wanting to give up... these are the amps I tested it with... at that time.. this crazy guy ran around town with the pair (still in its original box) to pair with this amp & that amp... this is the list:-
1. Arcam Alpha 9 int amp (bought it..& "die ! I told myself"... ...sounded horrible to me with my 35a)
2. Primare I21 int amp (ok but was not prepared for the price)
3. Rotel RC870BX Pre + RB890 Power (so so to me)
4. Creek Classic 5350SE int amp (ok but also pricy for me)
5. Creek EVO in amp (er...no comment..I think cannot match)
5. Rotel RC-03 Pre + RB03 Power (so so to me)
6. MF A120 int amp (to me feels like not enough power?)
7. Holfi Integra 8 (the first amp below 2k which sounded ok)
8. Quad 44+405-2 (finally... something to my liking, I bought it..but ended up pairing it with a pair of Epos..so hunting again for amp for the 35a)
9. Denon AVR1907 (ok but is more for AV)
10. PASS Adelp Pre + Krell KSA200S Power (first impression very good with lots of detail... however I feel it "rough" for vocals)
11. Audion int vavle amp model ?? (300B) 3.5Wpc)...vocals ok
12. Soffin int valve amp (300B) (China made) .. vocals ok..bass??
13. Audiovega MC88 valve amp - er.... feel not enough juice to drive
& I started to add passive sub to the 35a
14. A huge China valve amp 70wpc with EL34 valves...ok..but amp is giant...
15. Naim Nait-3 int amp ... wow this amp is powerful !! .. but vocals??
16. Rogers E20a int valve amp - very good.. but cannot drive my sub-woofer
17. Quad 34+606mk1 (powerful...but found the vocals very rough to me.. gave it back after 2 nights...lost money.. :-(
18. Quad 33+303 (..ok...bought it !!)
18. Quad-II monoblocks (...wow..the smoothness of vocals..also surprising drove the passive sub easily)...asking price stopped me..also I had the 33+303 already...
19. Leak Stereo 20 (...also the vocal smoothness. .. did not get to test with sub)
21. Pilot valve amp model ? (..smooth..but sub ??)
22. Quad 34+306 (also ok... bought a set thro ebay...)...

So at the moment.. I am with Quad 33+303 and also Quad 34+306 alternate...driving the Rogers LS35a with passive sub. ... has stopped the crazy running around... Above just my experience... guess if the budget has been higher, the "hunt" would have been easier ??
Hope this helps those who wish to set up 35a set.
Kind regards
Cham TS

Cham TS,
For your info Rogers LS3/5A with AB1 is not easy to drive with Quad 34+306. It can only produced you 60% in soundstage. This are really hungry speaker.

A friend of mine own a Roger LS3/5A (11ohms) with AB1 facing same problem like you. At last i solved the problem for him. i built him a 2x2 dual mono 100W Class A/B DMOS Power amplifier. (2 set of 100W Dual mono in one amplifier or 4 x100watts).

there is 2 sets of output in my design. 1 set of hi output for the top speakers LS3/5A and another set of low output for the AB1. It was very well control and sound was fantastic even all my kaki's heard it.

sorry i am not so good in explaining in words but i can be contact at 016-3805533. those who wish to see the picture of my power amp please feel free to call or pm me.

thanks
alex_kff (kajang foo)

Hi Alex,
Possible to listen to your friend's set 35a+AB1 + your amps ?
The sub which I am using is DIY, so I feel it is still ok for the small wattage 33+303 & 34+306. I had bought & hooked up the 34+606 (130wpc) but did not like the sound although it is much more powerful... I listen to a lot of slow jazz vocals... hardly play any fast numbers...also the set is in a very small room... with the 34+606, I felt like the singer is screaming at me...I had my 44+405-2 at that time, when A/B comparison.... the 44+405-2 is so much more soothing.... maybe that's why I did not miss the power at all... I returned the 34+606 after only 2 nights listening... Anyway I will like to listen to the set you built if possible.
Kind regards
Cham TS

Looks like you have searched most hifi stores to match up the LS35a. it is rather good learning experience matching the speakers. Just wonder if you have considered Joseph Ki method of matching the LS35a and AB1 with the amps.

I believe McIntosh is probably a good partner for that.

As for the sound, I felt Joseph setup can play a host of musics, be it chamber, you name it.

I assume you (LS3/5A fans) know there is a very strong group of LS3/5A owners, a club I believe, here in Malaysia. They are so active that they often exhibits in the KLAVS and only for the sake of sharing their love of this speaker with fellow hifi enthusiasts. I would think that there is a wealth of knowledge in that club and if anyone wishes to find matching amps or cables or just simply want to extract the max from their LS3/5A, that this club would be a good place to visit (assuming you are not already a member of the club). Anyone who wishes to hear what the LS3/5A is capable of, or even simply wants to find out what the 'fuss' is all about probably can learn a lot from them as well. If there is a need, I believe I can help get contact info on the club as I have a number of friends who are members. In fact, I know (not sure of the spelling) Johkey and apparently he founder and president for life of the club (very nice guy, we always have lots of fun fooling around at my dealer's place), so I think I can get his contact if you need. Or probably ppl like bassraptor have his contact handy (not sure if he wants ppl to just call him or not).

I like my LS3/5 with my 80W OTL amp. However, no bottom. Have since purchased a pair of AB1 a while back but never got round to testing the combo yet

Alright! thanks for sharing your experience with LS3/5A. Perhaps you have not listened to a nice LS3/5A set up yet.

Rgds.

mugenfoo wrote:aisey.... that whatever ls3/5a with subwoofer is cheating one ..... This subwoofer lah, that subwoofer lah, some particular style of subwoofer placements...

As in loudspeakers and in internal combustion engines, the old saying goes: "There is no replacement for displacement".

anyway yes if u want clarifications, i've heard ls3/5a partnered with Audio Research, Jadis, Sonic Frontiers (anyone still remember this brand?) , even some more "down to earth" Audiolabs, Creeks, sugdens.... etc etc.
Rogers, Spendors, and Harbeths being the LS3/5a i have listened to. Spendors being the most time with.

Hi Cham,

If budget is not a constraint, which amp you would pick for LS3/5A?

Rgds.

chamts1 wrote:Hi all,
Just to share my "journey" about 3 years ago when I started to put together a set for myself. I was introduced to the hifi world by my colleague having a set of Quad 66-CD, Quad Pre-Amp 34, Quad 306 Power Amp, driving a pair of Harbeth HL-P3. I was amazed. I went hunting starting with speakers in the used market here... cos I heard the HL-P3 ES2 at Tropical & I still like the old HL-P3 better. But I ended with a pair of Rogers 11 ohm LS35a. This pair given me the nightmare of finding a satisfactory amp to drive it..... along the way another pair of HL-P3 came by, I bought it, but found that it is so much easier to find matching amp for it.. & sold it on to my bro. Back to the Rogers LS35a... not wanting to give up... these are the amps I tested it with... at that time.. this crazy guy ran around town with the pair (still in its original box) to pair with this amp & that amp... this is the list:-
1. Arcam Alpha 9 int amp (bought it..& "die ! I told myself"... ...sounded horrible to me with my 35a)
2. Primare I21 int amp (ok but was not prepared for the price)
3. Rotel RC870BX Pre + RB890 Power (so so to me)
4. Creek Classic 5350SE int amp (ok but also pricy for me)
5. Creek EVO in amp (er...no comment..I think cannot match)
5. Rotel RC-03 Pre + RB03 Power (so so to me)
6. MF A120 int amp (to me feels like not enough power?)
7. Holfi Integra 8 (the first amp below 2k which sounded ok)
8. Quad 44+405-2 (finally... something to my liking, I bought it..but ended up pairing it with a pair of Epos..so hunting again for amp for the 35a)
9. Denon AVR1907 (ok but is more for AV)
10. PASS Adelp Pre + Krell KSA200S Power (first impression very good with lots of detail... however I feel it "rough" for vocals)
11. Audion int vavle amp model ?? (300B) 3.5Wpc)...vocals ok
12. Soffin int valve amp (300B) (China made) .. vocals ok..bass??
13. Audiovega MC88 valve amp - er.... feel not enough juice to drive
& I started to add passive sub to the 35a
14. A huge China valve amp 70wpc with EL34 valves...ok..but amp is giant...
15. Naim Nait-3 int amp ... wow this amp is powerful !! .. but vocals??
16. Rogers E20a int valve amp - very good.. but cannot drive my sub-woofer
17. Quad 34+606mk1 (powerful...but found the vocals very rough to me.. gave it back after 2 nights...lost money.. :-(
18. Quad 33+303 (..ok...bought it !!)
18. Quad-II monoblocks (...wow..the smoothness of vocals..also surprising drove the passive sub easily)...asking price stopped me..also I had the 33+303 already...
19. Leak Stereo 20 (...also the vocal smoothness. .. did not get to test with sub)
21. Pilot valve amp model ? (..smooth..but sub ??)
22. Quad 34+306 (also ok... bought a set thro ebay...)...

So at the moment.. I am with Quad 33+303 and also Quad 34+306 alternate...driving the Rogers LS35a with passive sub. ... has stopped the crazy running around... Above just my experience... guess if the budget has been higher, the "hunt" would have been easier ??
Hope this helps those who wish to set up 35a set.
Kind regards
Cham TS

joeling wrote:I like my LS3/5 with my 80W OTL amp. However, no bottom. Have since purchased a pair of AB1 a while back but never got round to testing the combo yet

Your set-up would be complete with the AB1. What feet does your AB1 comes with? I am looking for a pair of suitable feet for my DIY AB1, more for levelling than anything else as my floor are very uneven.

I found that you get better presence in the vocal with the sub than without it. Mine is paired with the Harbeth HL P3.

presence, soundstage, meaty, room filling. what recipe is your AB1. same as in ls35a.com

A good valve amp with 12W or more is usually prefered for LS3/5a for more or better presence, live and musicality for a wide genre of music....period. If not mistaken most seasoned LS3/5a owners surely use a valve amp for it most of the time. Of course goes without further argument that you can use whatever that pleases you.

rsbn589 wrote:Alright! thanks for sharing your experience with LS3/5A. Perhaps you have not listened to a nice LS3/5A set up yet.

Rgds.

Perhaps.

And perhaps you have not listened to better systems beyond the Ls3/5a ?

[quote="rsbn589"]Hi Cham,

If budget is not a constraint, which amp you would pick for LS3/5A?

Rgds.

His rsbn589.... er... must say it is not an obvoius answer for me now.. Also.. i had not meant to start long discussion solely on 35a.. I am in the mailing list of the ls35a club moderated by Joseph Ki. I had limited time to visit the 2008 KLAV show so I spent all my time in the ls35a room. The amp that really caught my attention then was the vintage Leak 12.1, I don't know how to describe it other than saying the smoothness of the music from the Leak 12.1 made other amps sounded "rough" to me. Also I must say the other amp which left sweet memories is Quad II, so if budget not a constraint, these are the 2 amps I will go for. Anyway... what I think is even in the club there are differring views & tastes... so I guess it is really up to one's music taste & preference. I think poeple in the ls35a club still consider their "journey" is still unfinished in finding the best match of amps, pre, cables. cd player, isolation etc etc... for me... I feel my journey of wild search to find the best match is slowing (or even ending)... will just like to enjoy the music ... hope this answers your question.
KInd regards
Cham TS

M7 wrote:Ho's is very close to the original Rogers

Ho's doesn't use tygan grills unlike all the other LS 3 5As. Wonder if it would sound closer if fitted with tygan grills.

[quote="chamts1"]

rsbn589 wrote:Hi Cham,

If budget is not a constraint, which amp you would pick for LS3/5A?

Rgds.

His rsbn589.... er... must say it is not an obvoius answer for me now.. Also.. i had not meant to start long discussion solely on 35a.. I am in the mailing list of the ls35a club moderated by Joseph Ki. I had limited time to visit the 2008 KLAV show so I spent all my time in the ls35a room. The amp that really caught my attention then was the vintage Leak 12.1, I don't know how to describe it other than saying the smoothness of the music from the Leak 12.1 made other amps sounded "rough" to me. Also I must say the other amp which left sweet memories is Quad II, so if budget not a constraint, these are the 2 amps I will go for. Anyway... what I think is even in the club there are differring views & tastes... so I guess it is really up to one's music taste & preference. I think poeple in the ls35a club still consider their "journey" is still unfinished in finding the best match of amps, pre, cables. cd player, isolation etc etc... for me... I feel my journey of wild search to find the best match is slowing (or even ending)... will just like to enjoy the music ... hope this answers your question.
KInd regards
Cham TS

Hi Cham,

thx for sharing your experince, do you know where or any hifi shop around k.l or pj that i can experience the Leak 12.1 or Quad II wth ls3/5a set up ?

[quote="tycham"]

joeling wrote:I like my LS3/5 with my 80W OTL amp. However, no bottom. Have since purchased a pair of AB1 a while back but never got round to testing the combo yet

Your set-up would be complete with the AB1. What feet does your AB1 comes with? I am looking for a pair of suitable feet for my DIY AB1, more for levelling than anything else as my floor are very uneven.

I found that you get better presence in the vocal with the sub than without it. Mine is paired with the Harbeth HL P3.[/quot

Hi Cham, by the way, any idea what is the current price for AB1 (used) campare to DIY AB1 ? where can i hear ls3/5a wth AB1 set up ard kl or pj ? I had a pair of 11 ohms Rogers but dun have a chance to drive it wth AB1...
I am new ls35a club member. have u heard Jo Ki set up before ? i hope i got a chance to experince his system..but hasn't hv a chance to meet him yet.

tubejunkie wrote:
thx for sharing your experince, do you know where or any hifi shop around k.l or pj that i can experience the Leak 12.1 or Quad II wth ls3/5a set up ?

I don't think there exist any system with those amps in any local shop. AFAIK there are, but likely privately owned. You may have to make friends with these individuals to get invited to enjoy it. Of course the other avenue if Joseph Ki puts up a show next KLAV show.
Leak and Quad amps are the preferred choice by some consensus but cannot say its entirely ideal. I'm sure these LS3/5a owners have listened to lots of forum hype and convinced of the same, went out to buy these amps. Leak and Quad are getting very rare, but there's many tube amps in the market that can also drive the LS3/5a well. Its all up to the owner, personal preferences and how best he can adapt to it all.

tubejunkie wrote:

tycham wrote:

joeling wrote:I like my LS3/5 with my 80W OTL amp. However, no bottom. Have since purchased a pair of AB1 a while back but never got round to testing the combo yet

Your set-up would be complete with the AB1. What feet does your AB1 comes with? I am looking for a pair of suitable feet for my DIY AB1, more for levelling than anything else as my floor are very uneven.

I found that you get better presence in the vocal with the sub than without it. Mine is paired with the Harbeth HL P3.

Hi Cham, by the way, any idea what is the current price for AB1 (used) campare to DIY AB1 ? where can i hear ls3/5a wth AB1 set up ard kl or pj ? I had a pair of 11 ohms Rogers but dun have a chance to drive it wth AB1...
I am new ls35a club member. have u heard Jo Ki set up before ? i hope i got a chance to experince his system..but hasn't hv a chance to meet him yet.

You would have to ask my brother TS.

The original AB1 came with spike feet.

[quote="tubejunkie"]

tycham wrote:

joeling wrote:I like my LS3/5 with my 80W OTL amp. However, no bottom. Have since purchased a pair of AB1 a while back but never got round to testing the combo yet

Your set-up would be complete with the AB1. What feet does your AB1 comes with? I am looking for a pair of suitable feet for my DIY AB1, more for levelling than anything else as my floor are very uneven.

I found that you get better presence in the vocal with the sub than without it. Mine is paired with the Harbeth HL P3.[/quot

Hi Cham, by the way, any idea what is the current price for AB1 (used) campare to DIY AB1 ? where can i hear ls3/5a wth AB1 set up ard kl or pj ? I had a pair of 11 ohms Rogers but dun have a chance to drive it wth AB1...
I am new ls35a club member. have u heard Jo Ki set up before ? i hope i got a chance to experince his system..but hasn't hv a chance to meet him yet.

Dear mugenfoo,

Let's not divert the topic of discussion. Your negative comments trigger my curiority and questions. Based on what you have replied, I dare to say that you have not listened to the formiable LS3/5A set up. Don't get me wrong. I NEVER say LS3/5A is better/best. I know and have auditioned better system beyond LS3/5A but I always give my full respect to this little giant killer, with the addiction of small qty in different variance in my collections.

Rgds,

mugenfoo wrote:

rsbn589 wrote:Alright! thanks for sharing your experience with LS3/5A. Perhaps you have not listened to a nice LS3/5A set up yet.

Rgds.

Perhaps.

And perhaps you have not listened to better systems beyond the Ls3/5a ?

Hi Cham,

I guess I understand your situation. Currently I'm playing BC1. Feel free to drop by (during your return home journey or at your convenient?)

Rgds,
KY

[quote="chamts1"]

rsbn589 wrote:Hi Cham,

If budget is not a constraint, which amp you would pick for LS3/5A?

Rgds.

His rsbn589.... er... must say it is not an obvoius answer for me now.. Also.. i had not meant to start long discussion solely on 35a.. I am in the mailing list of the ls35a club moderated by Joseph Ki. I had limited time to visit the 2008 KLAV show so I spent all my time in the ls35a room. The amp that really caught my attention then was the vintage Leak 12.1, I don't know how to describe it other than saying the smoothness of the music from the Leak 12.1 made other amps sounded "rough" to me. Also I must say the other amp which left sweet memories is Quad II, so if budget not a constraint, these are the 2 amps I will go for. Anyway... what I think is even in the club there are differring views & tastes... so I guess it is really up to one's music taste & preference. I think poeple in the ls35a club still consider their "journey" is still unfinished in finding the best match of amps, pre, cables. cd player, isolation etc etc... for me... I feel my journey of wild search to find the best match is slowing (or even ending)... will just like to enjoy the music ... hope this answers your question.
KInd regards
Cham TS

Hi KY, pardon me, did not know it is you. Ya... will be interested to listen the BC1, will contact you soon. . . your ESL is not up yet ? Lee (subang ESL63 is keen to meet you).

Hi tubejunkie... AB1.. I only came across 2 pairs, one was playing in LS35a room yr 2008 KLIAV show (Joseph Ki), another pair owner wanted to sell rm2,800. Condition was bad & I could not hear much improvement at that time when paired with my rogers 11ohm.. also the amp then was not good match i think. It was in tong lee KL. If you request to Joseph Ki thro the yahoo group for a visit to listen to his set, it should be most ideal, bring your 35a too, perhaps I can bring mine... pm me if you are keen.
I will like to mention here I wish to thank rsbn589 for the listening session with Leak ST20 & Pilot ??.... But if you wish to listen with AB1, best to visit Joseph Ki.
Kind regards
Cham TS

joeling wrote:The original AB1 came with spike feet.

tubejunkie wrote:

tycham wrote:

joeling wrote:I like my LS3/5 with my 80W OTL amp. However, no bottom. Have since purchased a pair of AB1 a while back but never got round to testing the combo yet

Your set-up would be complete with the AB1. What feet does your AB1 comes with? I am looking for a pair of suitable feet for my DIY AB1, more for levelling than anything else as my floor are very uneven.

I found that you get better presence in the vocal with the sub than without it. Mine is paired with the Harbeth HL P3.[/quot

Hi Cham, by the way, any idea what is the current price for AB1 (used) campare to DIY AB1 ? where can i hear ls3/5a wth AB1 set up ard kl or pj ? I had a pair of 11 ohms Rogers but dun have a chance to drive it wth AB1...
I am new ls35a club member. have u heard Jo Ki set up before ? i hope i got a chance to experince his system..but hasn't hv a chance to meet him yet.

Hi joeling

Thanks for the reply. I just fitted mine with Soundcare Superspike. Works better than the cheap spikes I used previously.

Hi tubejunkie

The last I know of the asking price of the Roger LS 3 5A paired with an AB1 was in July 2009 in echoft: http://www.echoloft.com/cgi-bin/buysell2/YaBB.pl?board=hifi&action=display&num=1247924930

Asking price SGD2200.00 which is a real bargain. At its peak the
3 5A alone would had set you back by SGD2000.00. Din't bother to check out the condition though.

alex_kff wrote:Cham TS,
For your info Rogers LS3/5A with AB1 is not easy to drive with Quad 34+306. It can only produced you 60% in soundstage. This are really hungry speaker.

thanks
alex_kff (kajang foo)

I am really curious as to which 40% of the soundstage that were not (re)produced. Would appreciate if you could kindly provide these information.

perhaps just a figure of speech that the Quad combo is not powerful enough to drive the speakers....

tycham,
LS3/5A is difficult to drive due to low impedance and complex crossover. Tube amp is not affected by impedance, constant power rating irregards to impedance hence LS3/5A is tube friendly. Its crossover drained much of the needed power. No power equal to poor soundstage. That why set need not apply unless resort to simple vocal and acoustic.

alex_kff wrote:tycham,
LS3/5A is difficult to drive due to low impedance and complex crossover. Tube amp is not affected by impedance, constant power rating irregards to impedance hence LS3/5A is tube friendly. Its crossover drained much of the needed power. No power equal to poor soundstage. That why set need not apply unless resort to simple vocal and acoustic.

Hi alex_kff

Excellent explanation. No wonder low power tube amp can drive the 3 5A so efficiently. Thank you.

alex_kff wrote:tycham,
LS3/5A is difficult to drive due to low impedance and complex crossover. Tube amp is not affected by impedance, constant power rating irregards to impedance hence LS3/5A is tube friendly. Its crossover drained much of the needed power. No power equal to poor soundstage. That why set need not apply unless resort to simple vocal and acoustic.

Hi Alex, what about 8 watts 300B amp ? sufficient ? irregardless of push pull or single ended design ?

chamts1 wrote:Hi KY, pardon me, did not know it is you. Ya... will be interested to listen the BC1, will contact you soon. . . your ESL is not up yet ? Lee (subang ESL63 is keen to meet you).

Hi tubejunkie... AB1.. I only came across 2 pairs, one was playing in LS35a room yr 2008 KLIAV show (Joseph Ki), another pair owner wanted to sell rm2,800. Condition was bad & I could not hear much improvement at that time when paired with my rogers 11ohm.. also the amp then was not good match i think. It was in tong lee KL. If you request to Joseph Ki thro the yahoo group for a visit to listen to his set, it should be most ideal, bring your 35a too, perhaps I can bring mine... pm me if you are keen.
I will like to mention here I wish to thank rsbn589 for the listening session with Leak ST20 & Pilot ??.... But if you wish to listen with AB1, best to visit Joseph Ki.
Kind regards
Cham TS

Hi Ts, thx for your info. Will certainly PM you when time is right. Currently thinking of reducing eco in my room. Considering custom make 50mm cotton wool panel for the wall.
Question is some say they are two type of acoustic room design. 1) studio Room 2) Live room
But question is how much sound absorption is enough ? Some say Studio Room sound too flat.
Must all good acoustic room come wth zero eco ? I mainly listen to vocals and jazz. My room size is 9'x 11' Ceiling height is 9'. Currently i place my speaker (ls3/5a) 4' from the wall.

Best,
Tubejunkie

Tubejunkie.
8 watts is insufficient to drive LS3/5A, the highs and
marco dynamics will be missing. It sound restrained. Anyway LS3/5A was
never designed driven with puny amp. Unexciting and dull.


Best regards,
alex

alex_kff wrote:Its crossover drained much of the needed power. No power equal to poor soundstage.

The crossover does not drain power - the proper understanding is that improper impedance matching causes one of the following:

1) Low impedance draws a large amount a current, and can cause a lot of heat in the amplifier. It lowers the efficiency of the amplifier, and can cause the amplifier to smoke.

2) High impedance draws too little current, i.e poor power delivery to the speakers.

This is for solid state amplifier. Tube amplifier behaves differently. Vast variation in impedance is always bad for the amplifier. Low impedance is especially dangerous.

How different is the tube and solid state when it is handling the speakers with differ peak and lows of the impedance across the freq spectrum.

CN Yee wrote:

alex_kff wrote:Its crossover drained much of the needed power. No power equal to poor soundstage.

The crossover does not drain power - the proper understanding is that improper impedance matching causes one of the following:

1) Low impedance draws a large amount a current, and can cause a lot of heat in the amplifier. It lowers the efficiency of the amplifier, and can cause the amplifier to smoke.

2) High impedance draws too little current, i.e poor power delivery to the speakers.

This is for solid state amplifier. Tube amplifier behaves differently. Vast variation in impedance is always bad for the amplifier. Low impedance is especially dangerous.

Perhaps you can show the mathematics regarding high/low impedances & matching and what-nots to back the above up ?

Sorry, you have to squint to see the diagram.
ZL represents the load (the speaker), ZS represents the components in the source system (i.e. the amplifier). As ZL decreases, more and more of the power will get dissipated in ZS, in the form of heat.

When ZL is zero (i.e. short circuit), all the power generated will be dissipated within the amplifier, a potentially catastrophic event. I believe that most amplifiers has build-in overload and sort-circuit protection.

Oh yes, the formula. Power = I * I * Z (Current square * impedance).

This is a very gross simplification. For more info, the Wiki is always handy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impedance_matching

CN Yee,
Excellent, at last you posted out the calculation website. But i am sure not everyone here will understand it.

I am inviting everyone here to read this wedsite below
http://klaudiodoctor.blogspot.com/

alex_kff
(kajang foo)

tubejunkie wrote:

chamts1 wrote:Hi KY, pardon me, did not know it is you. Ya... will be interested to listen the BC1, will contact you soon. . . your ESL is not up yet ? Lee (subang ESL63 is keen to meet you).

Hi tubejunkie... AB1.. I only came across 2 pairs, one was playing in LS35a room yr 2008 KLIAV show (Joseph Ki), another pair owner wanted to sell rm2,800. Condition was bad & I could not hear much improvement at that time when paired with my rogers 11ohm.. also the amp then was not good match i think. It was in tong lee KL. If you request to Joseph Ki thro the yahoo group for a visit to listen to his set, it should be most ideal, bring your 35a too, perhaps I can bring mine... pm me if you are keen.
I will like to mention here I wish to thank rsbn589 for the listening session with Leak ST20 & Pilot ??.... But if you wish to listen with AB1, best to visit Joseph Ki.
Kind regards
Cham TS

Hi Ts, thx for your info. Will certainly PM you when time is right. Currently thinking of reducing eco in my room. Considering custom make 50mm cotton wool panel for the wall.
Question is some say they are two type of acoustic room design. 1) studio Room 2) Live room
But question is how much sound absorption is enough ? Some say Studio Room sound too flat.
Must all good acoustic room come wth zero eco ? I mainly listen to vocals and jazz. My room size is 9'x 11' Ceiling height is 9'. Currently i place my speaker (ls3/5a) 4' from the wall.

Best,
Tubejunkie

Hi Tubejunkie,
Er.. sorry must say got no experience about room acoustic other than that different room makes BIG impact to the same set. My LS3/5a also in small room 7.5'W x 10.5'L, ceiling 8.5'. It is place firing down the 10.5'L of the room, the back of the speakers 2.5' from the rear wall, & since the room only 7.5' W, the speakers side is about 1' from the side wall only. The DIY sub is behind each of the speakers, the bass in this smalliest room is quite ... should i say "heavy"... it is the way i like it... listened the same setup in a larger room before... the bass is less pronounce.... maybe other members can help you with room tuning stuff... Good luck & don't forget to enjoy the music along the way.
Kind regards
Cham TS

Hi TS, thanx for your reply.. no worries. Managed to 'google' some helpful info..NIce to hear you hv a sub for ls5/5a.. by the way, what's the different btw a DIY and AB1 sub ? r they using the same driver and cross over ?

Best,
Tubejunkie

tubejunkie wrote:

chamts1 wrote:Hi KY, pardon me, did not know it is you. Ya... will be interested to listen the BC1, will contact you soon. . . your ESL is not up yet ? Lee (subang ESL63 is keen to meet you).

Hi tubejunkie... AB1.. I only came across 2 pairs, one was playing in LS35a room yr 2008 KLIAV show (Joseph Ki), another pair owner wanted to sell rm2,800. Condition was bad & I could not hear much improvement at that time when paired with my rogers 11ohm.. also the amp then was not good match i think. It was in tong lee KL. If you request to Joseph Ki thro the yahoo group for a visit to listen to his set, it should be most ideal, bring your 35a too, perhaps I can bring mine... pm me if you are keen.
I will like to mention here I wish to thank rsbn589 for the listening session with Leak ST20 & Pilot ??.... But if you wish to listen with AB1, best to visit Joseph Ki.
Kind regards
Cham TS

Hi Ts, thx for your info. Will certainly PM you when time is right. Currently thinking of reducing eco in my room. Considering custom make 50mm cotton wool panel for the wall.
Question is some say they are two type of acoustic room design. 1) studio Room 2) Live room
But question is how much sound absorption is enough ? Some say Studio Room sound too flat.
Must all good acoustic room come wth zero eco ? I mainly listen to vocals and jazz. My room size is 9'x 11' Ceiling height is 9'. Currently i place my speaker (ls3/5a) 4' from the wall.

Best,
Tubejunkie

If u got two aspects of the room having the same length (9' height & 9' length or width), then there would be buildup of some very strong standing waves.

Depending on ambient temperature, barometric pressure & humidity, you should be experiencing a very strong boom at approx 50~60Hz . Is that the case for your listening room now ?