Re: PC Based Audio Systems... Anyone here use them?

by tycham Sun May 30, 2010 2:27 pm

Do you need the external 8-12V supply to power up the X2, or the power supply is from the 5V USB header?

by chua55 Sun May 30, 2010 9:53 pm

It is not necessary. However I do plug in a power supply as my teralink is about 2m away from the notebook.

I used the regulator taken off from the Linksys router. There is a difference (not day and night) with the external power supply.

by mikechai Tue Jun 01, 2010 3:14 pm

To get the most out of the Teralink X2:
1. Use a linear regulated power supply (or better yet redwine audio black lightning if got unlimited budget) Wink

2. Try the ultravox from Yeo. http://diyparadise.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=124

The M2Tech hiFace also appreciates a better quality self-powered USB hub like the Vaunix Lab Brick USB Hub --> http://www.labbrick.com/standard-products.html#USB-hub

by tycham Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:58 pm

mikechai wrote:The M2Tech hiFace also appreciates a better quality self-powered USB hub like the Vaunix Lab Brick USB Hub --> http://www.labbrick.com/standard-products.html#USB-hub

How does the lab brick work? USB wire from comp USB port to Lab Brick USB port?

by mikechai Wed Jun 02, 2010 10:34 am

tycham wrote:
mikechai wrote:The M2Tech hiFace also appreciates a better quality self-powered USB hub like the Vaunix Lab Brick USB Hub --> http://www.labbrick.com/standard-products.html#USB-hub

How does the lab brick work? USB wire from comp USB port to Lab Brick USB port?

The Lab Brick is just a special 4-port active hub, usually used for industrial test equipment. It is powered by external DC power supply. Features according to the manufacturer: "Ultra low noise performance, Superior voltage regulation
for high current devices, Rugged cast aluminum enclosure". Since this device is reactively decoupled from the PC and is well filtered, it will help to bring out more performance out of hiFace, especially if your PC is relatively noisy. My experience is, the hiFace sounds more fluid, a bit better soundstaging and imaging. YMMV. The device is more expensive than the hiFace though...

by **VS126** Wed Jun 02, 2010 10:46 am

Mike,

How do you split the power going to the Hiface?

by mikechai Wed Jun 02, 2010 11:19 am

VS126 wrote:Mike,

How do you split the power going to the Hiface?

By plugging the hiFace to the usb hub that regulates the power(like the lab brick), the 5V supplied to the hiFace is in theory better than directly plugged into PC's usb port. This is just a tweak without dissecting the hiFace Wink

by lga775 Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:14 am

lol.. using PC as transport lo.. the to diy dac. using PCI sound card with SPDIF. Not using USB. internal processing Upsampling. 88.2khz out.

by chua55 Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:41 am

Hope you enjoy it, if by any chance, drop by some setup with those digital transport and hear it out. did u know reversing the spdif cable give u different reading on jitter. Wrong spdif cable direction gives 2 times the jitter reading. some say smps has better sound than linear ps.

it is so difficult to get things right when Hifi gets mixed with computers.

by lga775 Thu Jun 03, 2010 3:33 am

lol i dun know about the spdif cable direction, i was using mogami coaxial and internal console cable.
hmm... i m not sure whether smps will better than linear.
but computer psu is definitely worst than linear..

hmm. i always prefer linear with quality components.
unless i have seen any quality smps.

**Below is only my experience, Do not blame!**
i find it music player software is crucial effecting the whether sound musical or not. any player that don sound musical, will totally shut my mood down then back to LiteFM. It is easy for computer transport to sound accurate and detail but hard to sound musical as it can be.. When HiFi sounds goes, musicality should stay on track. Not just fidelity.

by lga775 Thu Jun 03, 2010 3:34 am

Pinging chua55: what is ur system setup?

by chua55 Thu Jun 03, 2010 4:48 pm

my setup,

dac and amp made in china cheap skate

Digital transport and coaxial cable made in china looks like a match box.

Notebook made in taiwan.

speakers, speakers cables and noise killer are unwanted parts I sapu, dunno if that helps.

Well on demo is another digital transport made in Italy.

by bimmerman Thu Jun 03, 2010 5:08 pm

You're too modest Chua. Your system sounds good to my ears.

Say, what's that italian digital transport you've mentioned???

by chua55 Thu Jun 03, 2010 5:18 pm

pm sent.

I am caught by this cable.

http://www.blackcatcable.com/page/veloce-digital-cable

review by

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/blackcat/veloce.html

not sure if 6moons review are 'neutral'

by lga775 Thu Jun 03, 2010 5:38 pm

oh okie... so wat software music players ur all using? foobar2000? itunes? WMP?

by chua55 Thu Jun 03, 2010 5:57 pm

I m using foobar2000. a software I haven't properly setup. I have difficulty to organize it in an 'itune' like album list.

by lga775 Thu Jun 03, 2010 6:16 pm

chua55: do u play 44.1khz output or upsampling

by mugenfoo Thu Jun 03, 2010 6:33 pm

Chua555, the Terralink unit , does it work on a Mac as well ?

Windoze got that foobar s/w, whatabout for Macs ? Any equivalents here?

by tycham Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:29 pm

chua55 wrote:pm sent.

I am caught by this cable.

http://www.blackcatcable.com/page/veloce-digital-cable

review by

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/blackcat/veloce.html

not sure if 6moons review are 'neutral'

Is Chris Sommovigo of the Stereovox XV-2/Ultra the designer of this cable? The connectors looks like those of the Stereovox.

by tycham Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:42 pm

chua55 wrote:I m using foobar2000. a software I haven't properly setup. I have difficulty to organize it in an 'itune' like album list.

How does itune album list looks like?

This is how I organised mine but hardly use foobar for playback.

PC Based Audio Systems... Anyone here use them? - Page 2 Alb_li10

PC Based Audio Systems... Anyone here use them? - Page 2 Alb_li10

by chua55 Thu Jun 03, 2010 9:43 pm

tycham wrote:
chua55 wrote:pm sent.

I am caught by this cable.

http://www.blackcatcable.com/page/veloce-digital-cable

review by

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/blackcat/veloce.html

not sure if 6moons review are 'neutral'

Is Chris Sommovigo of the Stereovox XV-2/Ultra the designer of this cable? The connectors looks like those of the Stereovox.

That's right. u have listened to stereovox ? is it good ?

I heard the black cat is an upgraded version of the stereovox.

by tycham Thu Jun 03, 2010 10:38 pm

chua55 wrote:I heard the black cat is an upgraded version of the stereovox.

If that's the case then I would bet it is an excellent cable. There are many happy suers of the Stereovox. Too bad I didn't get to try the Stereovox. Was contemplating between Stereovox and Chord Company Indigo Plus and ended up buying the Indigo Plus instead because Chord Company after sale service was exemplary.

by chua55 Thu Jun 03, 2010 11:19 pm

can u post some guide as to how u make your foobar itune like.

Is there any local agent where I can compare the stereovox ? I heard the DH Labs and there are good.

by tycham Fri Jun 04, 2010 12:39 pm

@chua55

The following drivers are required to be added to fooobar components folder.

Download foo_uie_albumlist-0.3.5.7z and foo_ui_columns-0.3.8.6.7z from http//yuo.be/columns.php

These are in 7-Zip format and you need to download 7-Zip utility from http//www.7-zip.org.

Right click on foo_ui_columns-0.3.7.3.7z and file goto 7-ZIP>>Extract files...

Change the Extract to: C\Program Files\foobar2000\components

Click OK

Do likewise for the foo_uie_albumlist-0.3.5.7z file.

Run foobar and this will appear:

Choose the Columns UI.

In foobar press Ctrl P>>>Display. From here you can configure the UI to your likings.

by lga775 Fri Jun 04, 2010 3:20 pm

i have another recommendation for computer transport fellows.
Try JRMC. i find it the way music sound correctly.

by kkthen Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:44 pm

tycham wrote:
chua55 wrote:I heard the black cat is an upgraded version of the stereovox.

If that's the case then I would bet it is an excellent cable. There are many happy suers of the Stereovox. Too bad I didn't get to try the Stereovox. Was contemplating between Stereovox and Chord Company Indigo Plus and ended up buying the Indigo Plus instead because Chord Company after sale service was exemplary.

I think Blackcat may better than my stereovox VX2 but in cheaper price. My VX2 will sound bright in some system, although this is my best digital cable in my system. After compare with DH labs d75, XLO Type 4 Reference , acoustic zen silver byte.

by **kakibook** Sat Jun 05, 2010 10:18 am

heard good review of stereovox, any local agent for it ? I heard great review of it and it can sound bright on some system.

by tycham Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:28 pm

Try Music By Design!

by chua55 Mon Jun 07, 2010 11:56 pm

Music by D was in CC. wonder where they are now?

wonder if there is any user of Legato. seems to have good review of it from computer audiophile

by joeling Tue Jun 08, 2010 8:13 am

That one not easy to buy lah. Still on the waiting list since before the product was launched.

chua55 wrote:Music by D was in CC. wonder where they are now?

wonder if there is any user of Legato. seems to have good review of it from computer audiophile

by chua55 Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:46 am

It is very rewarding to invest in usb-spdif. I am so surprise Legato has got such an overwelhming response.

I am now running on hiface and it is still in 'burn in' mode. was swapping the usb cables and even direct connection to notebook and cant even hear any difference.

however, the post processing using foobar will show immediate difference. available filters include hdcd and 24bit/16bit. On 32bit, cant lock on.

by bimmerman Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:37 am

I'm still new to Foobar. How do you access the post processing features you've mentioned? Do you need to add plugins for these features???

by chua55 Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:45 am

Actuall no plugin required. At Library, click Configure.

choose either Output (for post processing) and DSP manager. for the HDCD, need to add component into your "ProgramFilesfoobar2000components" from here

http://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_dsp_hdcd

However your ML can detect the HDCD stream. wonder if it changes the sound.

quote "
This DSP component will decode HDCD data in any 16-bit PCM stream passed through it, resulting in 20-bit PCM. It also buffers up to a second ahead in case the sample data is not HDCD, so as not to apply a volume reduction to non-HDCD files"

by joeling Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:49 am

Totally agree. I'm using Empirical Audio Offramp 3 to feed my beloved AN 1.1(frankenstein mods include shunt regulated B+ power supply, async reclocking, 1.2 output board). Better than Ayre QB-9 (gave me a headache literally) & better than Weiss Minerva on AES/EBU so far. Still working on to try out the Weiss on firewire interface on MAC Mini soon if I can get off my lazy bum.

The legato seems to be interesting but still waiting fro them to sell one to me.

Also eyeing the Empirical Audio Pace Car USB. Still hesitant to pull the trigger though as very expensive.

chua55 wrote:It is very rewarding to invest in usb-spdif. I am so surprise Legato has got such an overwelhming response.

I am now running on hiface and it is still in 'burn in' mode. was swapping the usb cables and even direct connection to notebook and cant even hear any difference.

however, the post processing using foobar will show immediate difference. available filters include hdcd and 24bit/16bit. On 32bit, cant lock on.

Regards,
Joe Ling

by chua55 Mon Jun 14, 2010 12:31 pm

tycham wrote:Try Music By Design!

I just found another type of digital coaxial that has good review.

http://www.sommercable.de/3__produkte/3__030_meterware/3__600_0174.html

I wonder if anyone has any experience and in Malaysia any shop carry it ?

by chua55 Mon Jun 14, 2010 12:35 pm

mugenfoo wrote:Chua555, the Terralink unit , does it work on a Mac as well ?

Windoze got that foobar s/w, whatabout for Macs ? Any equivalents here?

aiyo, I totally miss this one. It works the same on mac as well. can use VLC but no itune to play flac.

by chua55 Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:31 pm

does anyone know of where to get 3.3V LiFePO4 batteries ?

by joeling Wed Jun 16, 2010 10:52 pm

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=6444&Product_Name=GENUINE_A123_Systems_26650A_LiFePo4_Cell_w/_tabs

www.hobbycity.com in Hong Kong has plenty for hobby applications.

by chua55 Wed Jun 16, 2010 11:03 pm

just getting myself ready to use battery power supply to the master clock and PLL clock to avoid the polluted computer power supply and noisy regulator.

by chua55 Sat Jun 19, 2010 11:49 am

there was some heated discussion about the hiface unit with a claimed designer of ART involved.

http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/449885/usb-to-spdif-converters-shoot-out-emu-0404-usb-vs-musiland-monitor-01-usd-vs-teralink-x-vs-m2tech-hiface/1605#post_6722286

To this effect, I will try to order the attenuator to see if it will upgrade the hiface with spdif connection to a next level.

In short, manufacturers seldoms gives input impedance certification and the effects of reflectivity connects to the gear will be important. Ideally the input impedance of dac shall be 75ohm across freq range, yes no ?

by chua55 Sat Jun 19, 2010 11:55 am

will see how this tools measure up when connected to the dac.

http://www.minicircuits.com/pdfs/HAT-10-75.pdf

any intention to mod your hiface it is here

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-source/153191-m2tech-hiface-usb-spdif-24-192khz-asynch-13.html#post2040520

explaination of why the attenuator is need is here

http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/498151/m2tech-hiface-mods-and-discussions#post_6724349

by **kakibook** Sun Jun 20, 2010 10:00 pm

Attached herewith the document explaining the works of fixed attenuators in tranmission wave.

http://www.minicircuits.com/pages/pdfs/an70001.pdf

The legato is designed for direct mount while the hiface is designed for direct USB mount. So who has the merits.

by chua55 Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:10 pm

I would like to check wif Krell dac users if you happen to see this 'attenuator' in your spdif input [it is quite huge].

PC Based Audio Systems... Anyone here use them? - Page 2 Radio-10

PC Based Audio Systems... Anyone here use them? - Page 2 Radio-10

by bimmerman Mon Jun 21, 2010 1:22 pm

Wow! Looks like the Flux Capacitor Dr. Emmett Brown used in the DeLorean for time travel.

by carz Mon Jun 21, 2010 1:54 pm

chua55,
what is the function of this this BIG 'attenuator' and what is the brand and model?

What is the advantage of installin this ?

by chua55 Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:08 pm

some claim spdif tranmission is flawed.

some claim with reduced jitter, listening to music has better focus and soundstage.

The termination point between transport and dac presents jitter.

That huge tranmission attenuator with heatsink attached to it is used to attenuate the signal.

They are in-line adaptors that can be connected at the start or end (or both?) of your digital cable. Cable reflections are one of the many sources of added jitter in every digital system. Reducing the strength of these reflections should result in a reduction in the jitter generated by the transport to DAC connection.

There are many situations where this should result in better sound. e.g hiface with higher than output voltage.

I would think that they will improve any SPDIF connection as I don't believe there is one made that is reflection free? They may also be an effective way of reducing the sonic penalty usually incurred in using a BNC to RCA adaptor. So this could mean that by using these attenuators an RCA input on your DAC should now be about the same sonically as a BNC input. BNC shall always be at the receiving end. "quote from mugen"

by Theaudiohub Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:47 pm

oops - shared links already.

Anyway I'm very curious how jitter "sounds" like.
I haven't chance upon this and it seems, it's like Dark matter where nobody can verify it unless you have the equipment.

Anyone here knows how to "jitter" your setup?

by Theaudiohub Mon Jun 21, 2010 6:57 pm

okay here is some ways to measure jitter -
http://www.lessloss.com/page.html?id=42
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/446451/jitter-measurement

by chua55 Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:49 pm

jitter measurement can also be found at the stereophile documents.

here is the explain about TDR

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time-domain_reflectometer

with the RF attenuator, assuming it is properly terminated (which it does from the specs), the signal travelling thru would be reduced by the x dB and once reflected, will be reduced by another x dB. Total 2x dB reduction.

Now if the sending voltage has lower fluctuation due to reflections, then the rise time (or the windows) for the TTL to sense logic level would stay more steady instead of mis-timing it.

can the RF engineer help explain.

doc about signal return loss

http://www.wenzel.com/documents/swr.html

by chua55 Mon Jun 21, 2010 9:55 pm

Hi Mugen,

do u happen to know where to get a 6dB or 10dB BNC fixed 75ohm attenuators ?

Farnell carries the radiall but cost a fortune for a test.

some of the users has given positive results about putting in the pad "fixed attenuators" at the coaxial cables.

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