cd transport

hi guys, what defines a good cd transport? what makes it so expensive to own one? i had experienced once with luxman transport & its nice, but had to return the unit since its having problems reading disc & seller said the alignment was way out of propotion. it does takes professional to re-align a transport. so pls share, until today im still searching for a reliable & long lasting but not to expensive transport. cheers

sori but what's the difference between cd transport and cd player?

Look at it this way - a cd player and an integrated amp is just like the window unit of an air conditioner where the blower and compressor is all in one. A cd transport and a dac or a pre-amplifier and a power amp is just like a split unit air-cond - the blower is separate from the compressor.

azri wrote:hi guys, what defines a good cd transport?

I would say number 1 would be sound quality followed by reliability. If you're worried bout transport drawers jamming, etc. just get a top loading transport with a manual lid. Bear in mind the laser and diode will eventually die so nothing lasts forever and even less so with today's products.

misterslumber wrote:Look at it this way - a cd player and an integrated amp is just like the window unit of an air conditioner where the blower and compressor is all in one. A cd transport and a dac or a pre-amplifier and a power amp is just like a split unit air-cond - the blower is separate from the compressor.

i dont get it

arremie wrote:

misterslumber wrote:Look at it this way - a cd player and an integrated amp is just like the window unit of an air conditioner where the blower and compressor is all in one. A cd transport and a dac or a pre-amplifier and a power amp is just like a split unit air-cond - the blower is separate from the compressor.

i dont get it

When you connect a transport to an amplifier and speakers to the amp on pressing the "Play" button on the transport you will not get any sound. To get sound, you need to connect the CD transport to something called a DAC (Digital Analog Converter) and connect the DAC to an amplifier and speakers connected to the amp. Please don't forget to press the "Play" button of course

I like this analogy

misterslumber wrote:Look at it this way - a cd player and an integrated amp is just like the window unit of an air conditioner where the blower and compressor is all in one. A cd transport and a dac or a pre-amplifier and a power amp is just like a split unit air-cond - the blower is separate from the compressor.

by arremie Today at 3:32 pm

misterslumber wrote:Look at it this way - a cd player and an integrated amp is just like the window unit of an air conditioner where the blower and compressor is all in one. A cd transport and a dac or a pre-amplifier and a power amp is just like a split unit air-cond - the blower is separate from the compressor.

i dont get it

arremie,

1) a cd player has a transport i.e. a motor to spin the cd and a laser to read the data, AND a dac section that links to the outputs where u plug yr interconnects to.

2) a cd transport has only the motor and laser pick-up. u need to connect it to an external dac.

3) however, a cd player can also be used as a cd transport by by-passing the internal dac section. what you do is link the digital out by cable or optical wire to an external dac.

ah ic now I got it. Same concept like integrated amp and pre-amp. Thanks guys

mari belajar ABC

haha pls pardon my ignorance

so, whos into cd transport? why is it so darn expensive? anyone here ever diyed one?

by azri Today at 2:50 pm

hi guys, what defines a good cd transport? what makes it so expensive to own one?... until today im still searching for a reliable & long lasting but not to expensive transport.

a good transport is one that can read the data without any errors.

try the belt-driven cec. one of the best around and quite affordable.

bro, ade 2, TL0x & TL51x. any idea how does it cost in bolehland?

Marrantz cd99 DR transport with cdm1 is very good。 I got mine RM 1600 4 years ago. Whoever come across this transport, just buy it n no regret...

cec tl51x is much cheaper. call music by desigh in jaya one, petaling jaya.

Sflam,

There r lot of cd transport cheaper than rm1600, but can u get what cd99 offer?it's weighted 15kg...

noodle88

what i meant was that cec tl51x is much cheaper than cec tl0x...

the cec tl51x costs more than RM1600. shld be around RM4k-plus

Sflam, I heard that TL0x is the best transport of cec, do u have any idea how much does it cost. 2 weeks ago there is a CEC TL1x for sale here but can't get it, it's sell very fast....

call simon choy, music by design.
019 2185164

arremie wrote:

misterslumber wrote:Look at it this way - a cd player and an integrated amp is just like the window unit of an air conditioner where the blower and compressor is all in one. A cd transport and a dac or a pre-amplifier and a power amp is just like a split unit air-cond - the blower is separate from the compressor.

i dont get it

Simple.

CD-transports cannot be connected to an Amp directly. Becoz transports only outputs a digital signal.
The digital signal then has to be fed into a "DAC" "Digital-to-Analog-Converter". Then this DAC connects to a hifi amp.

CD-PLAYERS, have the "DAC" portion built-in as well. So u can connect the CD-Player directly to a hifi amp.

arremie wrote:ah ic now I got it. Same concept like integrated amp and pre-amp. Thanks guys

No. Not really.

The outputs of a CD transport vs a CD player are totally different.
The signal domains are totally different. A TRANSPORT's output is purely digital. Whereas a player outputs ANALOG signals.

Although alot of CD players can also play the role of a TRANSPORT if that player offers a Digital output.

Again, a dangerous motherhood statement.

No transport out there is absolutely bulletproof. Given a bad enough scratched up to damaged CD, any transport would still read lots of errors and are still subject to mistracking/skipping/jittering just the same as any other CD reading machine.

Besides, reading it with "least errors" is only one aspect of a good transport.
The other important CRITERIA for sonic excellence is to deliver the bits with "least amount of Jitter" as well.

Thats why cost-no-object transport systems place alot of emphasis on CLOCKING techniques for the latter.

sflam wrote:
a good transport is one that can read the data without any errors.

4 grand sounds reasonable. im waiting for CEC japan to reply my email regarding on price quote for both 0 & 51. but that 0x fuhhhh.. stimmm!!

Azri,

You wanna buy directly from Japan ka?

mugenfoo wrote:
CD-transports cannot be connected to an Amp directly.

mugenfoo, thanks for the more clear explanation. My CDP got both analog and
digital ouput. When using analog it will behave like any CDP would using
on board DAC to change digital to analog and send to amp. When using
digital it will act as a transport and will let the DAC on my amp do the decoding.

So my CDP when acted as a transport do have a direct connection to the amp via digital cable. How's it you are saying a transport unable to connect directly to amp? Do you meant to say power amp? I believed even pre-amp has a DAC on board. Please shed some light. Thanks

encik karoskop : i doubt theres a c.e.c dealer in australia, but if they do, the price will be like shiat!! so better ask than guessing, u'll never know what u gonna get!

encik armi, normally avrs that have digital inputs. what amp are u using?

Oh sorry .. yes, if you're using an AV amp that can take a DiGITAL input .. yes, then you can feed a digital signal directly to it.

I was referring to more traditional minimalist / purist Stereo Amps that only can take ANALOG inputs.

My bad..

arremie wrote:

mugenfoo wrote:
CD-transports cannot be connected to an Amp directly.

mugenfoo, thanks for the more clear explanation. My CDP got both analog and
digital ouput. When using analog it will behave like any CDP would using
on board DAC to change digital to analog and send to amp. When using
digital it will act as a transport and will let the DAC on my amp do the decoding.

So my CDP when acted as a transport do have a direct connection to the amp via digital cable. How's it you are saying a transport unable to connect directly to amp? Do you meant to say power amp? I believed even pre-amp has a DAC on board. Please shed some light. Thanks

ah ic ic. I never own a stereo amp before. Didn't know they don't have digital input. So far all I use is AVR as I'm more of a AV guy but now I'm starting to show interest in stereo music. So for the time being I'm fiddling with what I have to get the best possible music (for my ears) until I can afford a dedicated stereo setup.

azri, my AVR is Marantz SR6003 and my CDP is Marantz CD6003.

azri wrote:
encik karoskop : i doubt theres a c.e.c dealer in australia, but if they do, the price will be like shiat!! so better ask than guessing, u'll never know what u gonna get!

chk this site http://www.sonicartaudio.com/CEC.htm

it's an australian site..

51x is $1690 (+25 on postage ) X 3.1 on currency = rm5316 whereas in bolehland its rm4k plus.. told you, the price in australia is like shiat!!

had used the marantz 99 b4 many yrs ago, had found the sound a little slow (lacking in dynamics). Maybe does not match my dac at that time. Traded in for the Audiolab CDM. Significant diff.

Also had the CEC TL1 for some time, another heavyweight. Soundstage & imaging very good but bass is its weak point ( 1 note bass & doesn't go low enough) thus affecting dynamics.

Currently, more satisfied with another heavyweight japo transport with a valve dac (both upgraded internally)

The audiolab cdm ia an excellent value transport at its current s/hand price...JMO

Audiolab?... pray the laser optics don't die on you. Its Philips based, a grade better than the one in the Marantz CD63.
Best thing about that Audiolab is the AES balanced output which is beneficial.

azri wrote:
51x is $1690 (+25 on postage ) X 3.1 on currency = rm5316 whereas in bolehland its rm4k plus.. told you, the price in australia is like shiat!!

i saw one in tong lee (the former cec distributor in malaysia) yesterday and the price is actually RM5k plus. sorry mate.

cmboy wrote:Audiolab?... pray the laser optics don't die on you. Its Philips based, a grade better than the one in the Marantz CD63.
Best thing about that Audiolab is the AES balanced output which is beneficial.

most philips laser can still be found either new/used/oem with some effort. The laser used in the mk1 is much much higher grade than the one in cd63.Seen many audiolab mk1 still spinning with ori lasers till date. Maybe u were referring to the mk2...there are millions of philips based laser cd players out there...

But not the case for my japo unit, its 'unobtanium' (as in Avatar,hehe) unless potong from another unit & its as rare as the black rose...

The transports made in the late 80s till mid 90s are kick ass machines....mine still spins flawlessly after 20yrs....as they said: "they dont make them like they used to" Me thinks that was the golden age of digital tech, every other co. was trying to push the digital edge both mechanically & electronically...

mr boxer, are you using the same dac for your audiolab & cec? If TL1x cant satisfy you.. how much does that audiolab cost you?

anyone ever has experience with little dot cdp 1? if you guys know this cd transport & anything that has similarity pls share. tqs

Yes, I'm refering to the Audiolab CDM MkII which implement the CDM12 transport. The Mk1 used the famed CDM9.
CDM12 have become disappointment for a multitude of problems in the aftermath.

[quote="boxer"]had used the marantz 99 b4 many yrs ago, had found the sound a little slow (lacking in dynamics)




Boxer,
cd99 can never be slow n lack in dynamics, u need to match the transport with a good dac n suitable digital link....

I have mine mod internally, it's fast n very dynamic.

Its already a popular trend to internally mod or upgrade vintage CD players to keep up with higher expectations of current audiophiles. Like anything else, those equipment were built with parts and technology of the day. Proven and tried boutique parts into old CDP's do give it a new lease of life and lift the sound to some degree at the same time. But then again, current state of the art DAC chips are quite different in sonic quality and character compared to DAC's of old. NO way someone will succeed modding say Wolfson or Cirrus Logic DAC based CDP to sound exactly or near a Philips TDA1541 based CDP.
Ok ok...this have gone a bit OT, this topic is about transport mainly.

On the Audiolab CDM , I've read that there exist a complex clock circuitry (3 internal clocks) for near best jitter reduction. Thats likely one reason why this transport is already an excellent performer in stock version and no real need for further mods, including re-clocking. If not for the Philips CDM curse, IMHO, this CDT is quite a gem and a class of its own.

azri wrote:mr boxer, are you using the same dac for your audiolab & cec? If TL1x cant satisfy you.. how much does that audiolab cost you?

I was using the TL1 not the TL1X.

It was ard. RM4.8k when I bought the audiolab.

The Mk 1 is good, using the cdm9pro transport. I'll leave out my comments on the Mk2.This is my personal experience as I've owned both b4 & had compared them side by side.

Like I mentioned above, I've traded in the marantz CD99 for the audiolab CDM. If i do come across another audioladb cdm I might consider keeping 1 if condition & price is good...

dacs have changed over the years but I believe it was always for the better... had dacs from the following brands: sonic frontiers, theta,dpa, monarchy, micromega, cec, audio alchemy, orelle & some cant recall now. Some of these dacs are upper mid-end at most, nothing from mark, reimyo, wadia etc higher end yet. hehe

feww.. thought you sold the rm45g for rm5g cdt & call it for a day heh

I am using lowerst model Cec tl5100 also got bass problem. Boxer Bro, Audiolab cdm mk1 will better than your CEC in vocal or not?

kkthen wrote:I am using lowerst model Cec tl5100 also got bass problem.

What bass problem?, would you please enlighten me because I've not experienced the shortcoming, if any.

kkthen wrote:I am using lowerst model Cec tl5100 also got bass problem. Boxer Bro, Audiolab cdm mk1 will better than CEC in vocal or not?

define the "bass problem" ?

"bass is its weak point ( 1 note bass & doesn't go low enough) thus
affecting dynamics " which describe by Boxer bro which is good enough. This happen to my old TL5100, The latest model ＣＥＣ　product looks like don't have this problem.

CD transport and DACs are an interesting subjects - certainly more complex than amplifiers (pre- and power). Emphasis seems to focus on clean power supply, square waves, bits, etc.

I have decided to embark on a diy project based on Phillips CDPro2LF transport, and TDA 1541A NOS DAC and tube buffer - all the parts have been ordered. Perhaps in due-time, I can share my sonic experience on how a diy compare with a commercial player (or at least comparing to my existing Meridian 506 with Burson op-amps).

kkthen wrote:I am using lowerst model Cec tl5100 also got bass problem. Boxer Bro, Audiolab cdm mk1 will better than your CEC in vocal or not?

Vocals from CEC TL1 i surely better than audiolab.

Maybe I've confused u guys. I didnt hve all the transports I mentioned above at the same time. Initially had played with a couple of cd players b4 i got the cd99.Later traded in for the audiolab mk1, Then got a mk2. Sold the mk2 & got some cd players along the way eg Meridian 506, denon S10 etc. When I got the japo transport, then sold the cdm mk1. CEC TL1 came along & went. Now still keeping 2 same cd players & the japo transport.....& yeah also letting go an Audio Agile cd player which I posted in the trade section some time ago....anyone interested? mint condition.

phew...hope i remembered correctly..

phew.. thats loads of money involved!!

sflam wrote:

azri wrote:
51x is $1690 (+25 on postage ) X 3.1 on currency = rm5316 whereas in bolehland its rm4k plus.. told you, the price in australia is like shiat!!

i saw one in tong lee (the former cec distributor in malaysia) yesterday and the price is actually RM5k plus. sorry mate.

Maybe can also contact Audio Perfectionist for the price.
They have the latest range of C.E.C on display.